150g turnaround

[akando]

Hello,
I am trying to turn around my 150g that I bought in September of 2009. It was running before I got it and this is my first tank. When resetting up the tank, I did not rinse any sand or scrub any rock. Reused most of the water. It survived the 6 hour move minus 2 fish.
These are pictures of it before it bought it.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/9d4c30b1.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/e2d4a210.jpg
This is it after the move
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/DSCN0523.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/DSCN0519.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/DSCN0508.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/DSCN0505.jpg
And this is it as of today.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/2aa62755.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/8359e34b.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/7067a374.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/eb3cc451.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/bc25457b.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/1c24d183.jpg

I got shipped out of town for work 3 days after moving the tank and just got back into town last week.
I left my dad the huge responsibility of maintaining it for me and with him being so busy, it did not happen.

I have been reading skimmer threads for a couple of months decided to buy one.
I bought a SM-100 Scrubber and installed last tuesday due to the fact that the MRC skimmer i was using was finicky to say the least.
It started growing slightly brown and i cleaned it 5 days after installing with a toothbrush (I now know not to) and this is a picture of it before I cleaned it yesterday.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/ad14d6e5.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/5542fd2d.jpg

GHA has started to detach from the LR and algae growth on the glass has slowed considerably.
More stuff has been coming out of rocks since skimmer was taken offline. Small starfish have been multiplying.
I am looking for advice on how much the skimmer will fix and if I should perform water changes to get nitrate levels down.

[Floyd R Turbo]

My experience with fish has been that as long as they are adjusted to Nitrate levels they'll do fine. So no need to panic. I've 'rescued' tanks with 800-1000 ppm Nitrate, knocked it down with PWCs and the fish are still alive. Just make sure your KH is good and PH is good. Let the scrubber do the work and keep the skimmer running until the scrubber is growing green for at least a couple weeks. Let the system reach a new stability point, then start backing off the skimmer, maybe dial the level down or shut it off a few days a week, then a few more days, etc. Make sure you clean the screen every 3 days until N drops. Make sure you are feeding the tank enough also. P appears like it's being absorbed by the algae in the DT, since it's low. You may eventually have to dose iron to get the growth you need to knock down the N but I'll let SM chime in on that one.

[SantaMonica]

I think his skimmer is already off.

Growth looks great for a week. The pool is a little deep at the bottom... see if you can decrease flow a bit, and it will give you a bit more working screen area.

Your scrubber box should start getting more full every 7 day cycle. After 4 or 5 full cleanings, your display will be much better and N and P will probably be zero. Although for all the phosphate to come out of the rocks, will probably take 6 months.

[akando]

Thanks for the insight.Yes, I used my skimmer pump to feed the scrubber. Even though my growth is brown, should I limit gleanings to 7 days now?

[SantaMonica]

Yes 7.

[akando]

2 week growth pics
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/dd59ffa5.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/eabb4969.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/fe733fe2.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/2f574a8b.jpg
(22 grams, forgot to tare out)

Hair algae in display is continuing to detach, brown algae on rocks is receding also.

[SantaMonica]

As the nutrients come down, growth will get greener and more hairy, and will start filtering even more.

[akando]

Here is 3 week growth pics.

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/e2c29011.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/0090adef.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/6a7fa369.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/0192243d.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/3e5e15e8.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/3241d3ea.jpg

[Floyd R Turbo]

Now that's some good scrubbin'!

[akando]

Now if only I could afford one more for the 72 bowfront...

[akando]

Question, I plumbed the return of my scrubber into the display like this :http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/f09c2463.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/1fa955e3.jpg
In hopes of keeping all pods in the display. The return is producing bubbles because as the water exits the scrubber, it is creating a tornado that sucks in air. Is there any way I can reduce bubbles in the display?

[Floyd R Turbo]

I'm dealing with that same issue with my ghetto 120g setup with the scrubber on top of the tank. So far, this is my solution

http://i611.photobucket.com/albums/tt191/FloydRTurbo/2011%20Aquarium%20Pics/120%20Reef/Temp%20Setup/2011-05-28/IMG_0117.jpg

http://i611.photobucket.com/albums/tt191/FloydRTurbo/2011%20Aquarium%20Pics/120%20Reef/Temp%20Setup/2011-05-28/IMG_0118.jpg

That's a 1L pop bottle and a 2L pop bottle wedged in place. I warned you. Way ghetto.

But my plan is to build a box out of egg crate to sit right below the dump point and put bio-balls in it to allow the water to disperse through and stop the bubbles. I tried the horitonal pipe with holes, it did not work at all. Then again, at that point the water level in the tank was about 2" below the rim, so there was quite a drop from the scrubber.

My dual-pop-bottle return diffuser works great right now though. I may try to patent it :mrgreen:

[SantaMonica]

Varying the flow helps sometimes. And of course various bubble removers:

http://www.radio-media.com/fish/UnderOverUnderPipe.jpg

[akando]

Wonder if I could implement that where my sm-100 dumps into to the tank.

[SantaMonica]

The last one, above, would be easy if it does not block the light. It's just a flat box.

[akando]

Am I right in assuming the airhole is above the water level?

[SantaMonica]

Yes. The idea with that one is that the bigger the area, the slower the flow in the box, and the more time for bubbles to get out.

[akando]

Here is week 4 growth pics
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/bc8fb1d0.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/7a7de858.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/5ff6014c.jpg

[akando]

Just to be sure, I clean both sides of both screens on the SM-100 every 7 days right?

[Floyd R Turbo]

Yes, that is for any scrubber.

[SantaMonica]

Although the screen is split so that you can just clean one of them every 5, 7, or 8 days, if you want to. If you are not getting nutrient spikes, no need to.

[akando]

Since nitrates are off the charts it's hard to tell at this point.

[SantaMonica]

You won't notice nutrient spikes if nutrients are at high levels.

[akando]

Good news! Nitrates are down to 20ppm. Harvest this week is the looking like it will be a quarter of what it was last week. Could it possibly be because of the low nitrates?

[SantaMonica]

No, 20 is not low.

[akando]

Maybe because I fed less?

[SantaMonica]

I don't know enough to say what it is, but what's more important is how your display progresses from month to month. All screens have up and down weeks.

[akando]

Here's 5 week pics. 174 grams this week.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/581fa481.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/85069556.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/fd1dcf9f.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/dfec1b3b.jpg

[SantaMonica]

Doesn't look like it's building up at the bottom. Let it go 10 days. The growth needs to spread out at the bottom and touch the window.

[akando]

I'll take pics at 7 days this week and show you. It was building up and starting to clog drain which pushed the water level in the box up to about 3".

[akando]

Here are pics from today. I normally would wait a day or two to clean.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/556c4248.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/1181044d.jpg

On a side note, what type of algae is growing on the rocks?
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/8246cb68.jpg

This is funny because it looks like coralline is growing on this hair algae.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/3c8098e7.jpg

[Floyd R Turbo]

That growth looks pretty patchy, I wouldn't expect to see much light through the screen like that. What are your N and P down to? SMs last suggestion was to let it go 10 days, are you on day 7 right now?

[akando]

Well, last week, I cleaned the screen on the left side too much. That screen does not have near the same amount of growth as the other one. Today is day 7, I believe I have been cleaning my screens too much for these past few weeks. I will test my N and P right now.

[akando]

Nitrate is 20, Phosphate is 0 according to the API Reef Master Kit

[SantaMonica]

Water level is too high in the box; slow the flow down.

[akando]

Cleaned my scrubber box today. There was 34 grams of algae inside the box alone. I haven't been cleaning the inside like SM suggests.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/7fa84e20.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/a96eb27e.jpg
PIcs of the screen at 10 days.(Before cleaning)
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/9cdc0a08.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/51ac2a26.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/c7e58927.jpg
Pics of screen after cleaning
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/32dbcd14.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/49893513.jpg
Water level at drain is 1" and far side of drain is 1 1/8" deep.
Is this acceptable?
Also, I draped my screen after cleaning over a bucket and it was dripping pink water onto the floor. Has anyone else seen this?

[kcress]

I've seen some pink yes. You still seem to be in dark-green territory and haven't turned the corner into the light green stuff.

[akando]

Yes, its only been 7 weeks but my parameters were horrible. Nitrates were off the chart but are now down to 20. Im still amazed that this scrubber has done what it has. :)

[akando]

Floyd,
I remember a post by you on RC about increasing the plumbing size on magdrive pumps to increase flow. I have a mag drive 18 and was wondering what plumbing size you recommended to run from the outlet to the bulkheads to get the maximum flow.

[Aeros]

I run all 1.25" hose.

Here is a great resource: http://www.reeflopumps.com/images/tips.pdf

[Floyd R Turbo]

Floyd,
I remember a post by you on RC about increasing the plumbing size on magdrive pumps to increase flow. I have a mag drive 18 and was wondering what plumbing size you recommended to run from the outlet to the bulkheads to get the maximum flow.

That's straight out of the danner mag-drive spec sheet: 1.5" return hose is suggested for maximum flow.

http://www.dannermfg.com/instructionsheets/ZG100.PDF

[Donj]

I know it sounds crazy, but it is true. The flow from my mag 18 doubled when I changed my 1in. pvc to 1.5in. F R turbo, what about a mag 7 on down, with a half in. nipple, do they still require a 1.5 on the return?

[Floyd R Turbo]

Go to dannermfg.com and look it up. They're all under the Data Sheets link at the top of the page

[akando]

Heres pics of the scrubber today. Today is the 7th day. I am thinking It may be time to change my bulbs.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/6cb792b0.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/2a964ec5.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/403cd681.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/d1c1357c.jpg

I remember seeing some posts about good places to buy replacement T5HO bulbs, can anyone give me a link?

[Floyd R Turbo]

https://www.aghydroponics.com/T5-2Ft-Gr ... 248308.htm (https://www.aghydroponics.com/T5-2Ft-Grow-Bulbs-24W-HO-3000k-8pack-p/litbulbt5-pxfl248308.htm)

[akando]

Awesome, thanks!

I did some googling, and found this http://www.1000bulbs.com/product/4944/FHO-24T5830F.html
Price per bulb is "cheaper"at 1000bulbs,but the link you supplied does free shipping which makes it 1.49 cheaper for the 8 pack.

[cruze]

post pic of tank now pleas :)

[SantaMonica]

Yes those are the ones I use.

[akando]

Will do tonight when I get home, still not too pretty.

[Floyd R Turbo]

AG hydro guys are cool dudes though. Very few places actually call you to verify your order before charging your card.

[akando]

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/263cd10e.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/ddb9429e.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/cd3896ad.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/21d12c27.jpg
And my 72 gallon...still want a scrubber for it. no cash for one though. cant seem to build a diy one that will work worth a crap.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/30017815.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/fbdd477c.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/91dimenc/150%20gal/e91c6a40.jpg

[SantaMonica]

Clean a bit more often since it's still dark. Maybe ever 5 or 6 days until it's more green.

[akando]

Thanks SM, I'll try that.

[akando]

Question, I broke down my 125 this weekend to move it and there was a lot of carbon in the sand and sump, this was from the previous owner, I was in a rush to set up last time and never rinsed the sand. There was also a LOT of detritus. Could the carbon have been causing me problems?

[Ace25]

I have never heard of carbon causing algae issues like you have. Worst case with what you describe is it could possibly lead to HLLE in certain fish (which you seem to have, Tangs, so in your case I would be concerned with carbon in the system), but other than that carbon doesn't usually cause any issues if a little gets in the tank, although obviously best to avoid. I have had my "oops" moments where either Rox carbon or GFO have made it into the tank/sand and stayed for years without issue except for the fact I get mad at myself for letting it happen every time I see some in the sand, but I do not have any fish that are susceptible to HLLE.

The built up detritus would be what I feel is one of the major causes of your problems and I would recommend just replacing the sand unless you feel it is cheaper for you to rinse out the old. I find the time to really clean old sand cost me more than just buying new sand, but I value my time at a certain rate. A good sandbed clean up crew makes all the difference. Don't slack on things that will clean the sand, but don't go overboard on certain creatures (thinking nassarius snails, a few are good, a lot can lead to hunger and dead fish since they will eat sleeping fish if hungry enough).

Also since you said you tore it down, no better time to get some stiff brushes out and really scrub the rocks clean. ;)

[SantaMonica]

If you have a CUC, then there won't be any detritus buildup; they will multiply to match it. If there is not enough detritus, they will die off to match it.

[akando]

Ace, I spent a good hour and a half rinsing the sand and it was really dirty. I ended up using the sand out of my 72 that I condensed into the 125. Will probably keep the 125 sand and experiment with it in a smaller tank.