SM100 Clone

[nickq]

Hi, I'm going to do a thread here on my SM100 clone.
First of all big thanks to SM for the design and openness of this entire project, I would have purchased one from the US but couldn't justify it with shipping to the UK.
I interpreted the design into a parts list and converted to metric for build in the UK:
[attachment=2:2eiv7guv]Image of Plans Metric.JPG[/attachment:2eiv7guv]

I've also ordered the LEDs from China as the scrubber is sitting on a shelf above the tank well away from moisture. I don't even get much evaporation off my tank since removing the sump.

I picked up the acrylic build today :D
[attachment=0:2eiv7guv]IMG_0131.JPG[/attachment:2eiv7guv]
[attachment=1:2eiv7guv]IMG_0129.JPG[/attachment:2eiv7guv]

hmm problem with adding more pics...

[nickq]

Here we go...
[attachment=1:1pme0u86]IMG_0132.JPG[/attachment:1pme0u86]
[attachment=0:1pme0u86]IMG_0133.JPG[/attachment:1pme0u86]

Just waiting for the gasket which was missing from the bulkhead connector, then I can do a water test.

Nick.

[kerry]

Looks real nice!!! Keep us posted.

[nickq]

Thanks, unfortunately I can't take any credit for it as I picked it up from the manufacturer all assembled :) I hope its watertight!
I might add a bead of silicone on the inside of the joints just in case.

[dxmarinefish]

Thanks, unfortunately I can't take any credit for it as I picked it up from the manufacturer all assembled :) I hope its watertight!
I might add a bead of silicone on the inside of the joints just in case.


Hi,
I live in the Uk, can you please tell me/pm the manufacture you used.
I have a need to rebuild my SM100 1st build and hopefully make it better.

[nickq]

Sure I'll pm as I'm not sure if I should post it here.

[nickq]

It's finally up and running and it was water tight :)
Drain is rather noisy and I can't open up my pump to max as its pulling so much air into the drain. Flow looks good across the full 17 inches though so I'll have to see how it goes and experiment with flow to get it quieter.
Omg the grow LEDs are bright!
I'll probably lag the drain pipe too as just wrapping a cloth around it quietens it down a bit.
I'll post picks when my adsl is fixed, I'm down to 160kbps at the moment!

[nickq]

Here are some pictures of it up and running...

Full tank shot with scrubber on shelf above.
[attachment=2:3q20dtjv]fts.JPG[/attachment:3q20dtjv]

Not so optimal drain, too many bends so its quite noisy, I'll have to work on this I just need to find another 1 inch union in the uk first..
[attachment=1:3q20dtjv]drain.JPG[/attachment:3q20dtjv]

The screen in situ, you will notice it's not the full 22 inches that this box can take, I've gone with 17 on account of my pump.
There is flow all the way across except for that very first bit at the left hand side, I guess it will move when some algae starts to grow.
[attachment=0:3q20dtjv]screen.JPG[/attachment:3q20dtjv]

3 days now, no sign of any growth, I really wish I'd seeded it now!
The bubbles in the tank are under control with the clear plastic pipe, its just rather noisy as the drain exits under the water, I'll experiment with this when I get the second union.

Nick.

[SantaMonica]

See if you can do all 45 degree bends in the drain

[nickq]

Day 4:

Nitrate 0 (was to start with)
Phosphate 0.040 ppm (measured in ppb phosphorus with Hanna test meter)

Starting to see some yellowing of the screen, so hopefully growth soon...
[attachment=1:2hk6g9o3]day 4 screen.JPG[/attachment:2hk6g9o3]
[attachment=0:2hk6g9o3]day 4 screen close.JPG[/attachment:2hk6g9o3]

Nick.

[kerry]

You are on your way!!

[nickq]

I've chosen a nice gloopy spot of the tank to use as a visual reference for the effectiveness of the scrubber.
Meet reference rock...
Day 4 reference rock:
[attachment=0:1r2m4rqo]reference rock.JPG[/attachment:1r2m4rqo]

[nickq]

Day 6


No real visible change yet but phosphate is measuring at 0.021ppm down from 0.040ppm in 2 days :!: (7 phosphorus ppb)
Probably just error due to different time of the day or something, time will tell...

[attachment=1:h0ta5qbw]screen day 6.JPG[/attachment:h0ta5qbw]

[attachment=0:h0ta5qbw]screen close day 6.JPG[/attachment:h0ta5qbw]

[kerry]

Its coming along, my 40G was a little slow to grow also.

[nickq]

Yeah I'm just kicking myself that I didn't rub my old horizontal screen against it to seed it, I chucked it straight in the bin on bin day!
:x

I'm impatient too :)

[kerry]

It will still happen soon enough. Mine (40G) took about 3 cleanings (weeks) before I started to get good growth. Now I clean it about every 4-6 days. Started this tank the weekend before fathers day. I still only get brownish type algae with a hint of green but, my nutrients are zero-ish so I am OK with that.

[nickq]

Day 7 today so should I clean it or let it go for 10 days?
It looks the same as the day 6 pictures.

[kerry]

I have alway cleaned mine after the first 7 but, left an untouched section in the middle so I had a comparison for the next cleaning because I am curious about things like that.

[SantaMonica]

It has no growth so let it go 14 days. The idea of cleaning is to keep growth from getting too thick.

[nickq]

Ok thanks for the advice.
I'm installing anti bubble and noise drain mark 2 tomorrow :? :roll:

[nickq]

Failed with drain mk2.
mk1 is much better, this could be a big problem going forwards :(
It's ok as it is by the flow is way down, I think only around 15gph/inch, hopefully my loading will be such that I can reduce the lighting hours to compensate and it will be all fine.

[nickq]

Day 12:

I think I see my problem:
[attachment=1:2a55g4r5]IMG_0168.JPG[/attachment:2a55g4r5]
[attachment=0:2a55g4r5]IMG_0169.JPG[/attachment:2a55g4r5]

Too much light for my flow right? I have green algae but only in the less light intense areas.

I can't increase my flow as the drain doesn't cope, I may add a second drain later to help this.
I'm currently lighting for 16 hours, any suggestions on what to reduce to?

Thanks,
Nick.

[nickq]

I re-read the new sizing guidelines and decided my screen is way to big.
I've removed one of them and taped up the slot, so now I have twice the flow over the remaining screen which is 36 square inches.
That should still be more than enough as I don't feed anywhere near 10 pinches of flake.
I'll leave the lighting at 16 hours for now as I should be hitting around 29 gph per inch on the remaining 8 inch long screen.

[SantaMonica]

It will fill in.

[dtyharry]

According to the size guidelines with 36 sqin you should be able to feed up to 30 pinches of food a day.

[nickq]

Day 20:
[attachment=0:27xz17ar]IMG_0178.JPG[/attachment:27xz17ar]

Not looking good :cry:
Second clean today, I really can't see it filling in so I've reduced the lighting down to 8 hours to see how it goes.
Phosphates 0.049ppm

[nickq]

Guys I'm at a loss.
Its day 4 of the 4th week and the screen still looks sterile (ish).
I had more gunk growing in the box than on the screen, does anyone have any ideas?

The lights have been down to 8 hours for the last 4 days but I don't see any difference yet.
I even turned the lights out on my display for 3 days in the hope it would out compete, but no change.

Thanks,
Nick.

[SantaMonica]

Keep it at 16 hours. Let it grow 14 days. Increase feeding.

[nickq]

Ok I will trust your judgement. I'll reset the lights and call tonight day 1.
Here is a pic of how much I feed each day:
[attachment=0:1mln9k8n]food.JPG[/attachment:1mln9k8n]

its about 3 pinches of my fingers.

My phosphates are highish at 0.04 and nitrates I can't detect but I'm assuming I have phosphates leeching out of the rock hence the growth on my rocks.
How much food would you suggest, double maybe?

Thanks,
Nick.

[dtyharry]

If I remember rightly you said your screen was 36 sq in so you can feed way more. The amount on that photograph is not going to generate much growth so either reduce the size of your scrubber or feed more.
Don't forget that algae needs nitrogen from nitrates etc in order to grow. You are not going to get nitrates produced without feeding. You seem to have plenty of phosphate available so maybe your scrubber is nitrogen limited at the moment.

[RkyRickstr]

I feed that much every feeding three or four times a day.. lol

[SantaMonica]

You could feed 10 times that

[nickq]

Ok I'll feed more, but this is just to get the scrubber kick started right, because my sceen could be nitrate limited?
I mean I don't want to feed the tank for the sake of feeding the scrubber long term. I suppose I could add some more fish.
I have 2 maroon clowns, a scooter blenny and a yellow tailed blue damsel at the moment, they all seem happy with the amount I feed now, I've had the clowns at least 3 years, the blenny and damsel are a few months in but the blenny seems to get all his food from around the rocks at the moment, pod production in the algae I guess.

I think the nitrates limited makes sense as that could explain why I didn't see any change with the tank lights out since that didn't affect the flow over my rocks and it could be the bacteria consuming the nitrates and not so much the algae, I mean I'm not really sure if it is algae in the DT, its not green. Perhaps I should turn down the flow on my Vortech also until the scubber takes the lead?

[SantaMonica]

I don't think our tanks get nitrate limited.

No you don't want to feed more and then reduce. Just feed what you want. You should probably reduce your screen size.

[nickq]

hmmmmm
Perhaps I can convince the wife this means that really...let's be honest...smaller screen not cool. What I need is a BIGGER TANK! :lol:

[kerry]

With more fish to feed heavier, dont forget that part!!!

[nickq]

I just noticed when I got back from work today that the water was spaying sideways in the box rather a lot.
I seem to have significant green hair growth on the screen just in the slot, all the way along, the middle of the screen is still empty.
Perhaps my slot isn't quite wide enough or perhaps my screen is pushed in too far?
How much of the screen should be in the pipe? Any at all, just a mm or so or shouldn't matter?

I think it is growing up there because the light is less intense.

Cheers,
nick.

[kerry]

I have made a light guard around mine, I used an old gravel vacuum tube cut to length and a small section cut out down the length of it then painted it black. This stops the light from causing growth in the slot.

[nickq]

Disaster strikes :!:
One of the seams popped open over night, obviously not welded properly :evil:
Water pouring down onto my DT light and back into the tank, light seems ok it just got the corner which is all heat sink.
Anyway, I've re-glued and also added silicone on the inside vertical edges, I also took the opportunity to add a second drain.

At least this means I'll get more flow now, but I do need to wait until tomorrow for the silicone to set.
I'm also going to make some wooden braces for the sides, what happened was the acrylic was bending under the warmth of the lights.

[nickq]

SM100 Clone mk 2

Updates from the weekend:

I added the second drain
[attachment=2:2lytxtr2]drains.JPG[/attachment:2lytxtr2]

Then came the attempt to make it all quieter, the drains drain straight down into some square pvc gutter pipe and into pipes within this which are split along their length and about 1cm taken out. This allows the water to empty towards the back of the gutter, it then flows forward and down the ramps.
[attachment=1:2lytxtr2]IMG_0191.JPG[/attachment:2lytxtr2]
[attachment=0:2lytxtr2]IMG_0189.JPG[/attachment:2lytxtr2]

[nickq]

Inside the scrubber there is a mini durso type of arrangement to make the drains quieter:
[attachment=1:igyks1xz]IMG_0194.JPG[/attachment:igyks1xz]
[attachment=0:igyks1xz]IMG_0195.JPG[/attachment:igyks1xz]

It works ok, still a fair amount of bubbles in the tank but if I turn the flow down a bit whilst working in the office it isn't too noisy.

[nickq]

Here's a short video of the drain:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSj4J819RG4

[nickq]

Its totally not working, the DT is looking worse than ever and the scrubber screen looks clean enough to eat off.
But I have a theory...

As I made my screen smaller I now have way too much light especially if you consider that the LED fixtures are mirrored inside so I think this is happening:
PIC 1 is how it should be with a bigger screen.
PIC 2 is what I have.
[attachment=0:2fmokwp8]light.JPG[/attachment:2fmokwp8]

There is so much internal reflection I bet I'm getting greater than 3W per square inch.

So to put this to the test last night I disconnected one of the lights, already this morning I can see a film of yellow on the screen which wasn't there yesterday.
will see what happens over the next few days with one light off...

[kerry]

I had my LED's concentrated with focusing lens's and it turned my screen back to the original white where the light focused, so you may be onto something there. Once I removed the lens's I started to grow algae again as my CFL did.

[nickq]

9 days later:

Reflection side:
[attachment=1:foktmwx6]lit side.JPG[/attachment:foktmwx6]

Lit side:
[attachment=0:foktmwx6]reflection side.JPG[/attachment:foktmwx6]

So interestingly its the most growth so far but again right up near the slot where light is less intense.
I don't really see any difference between the lit and reflection sides other than the growth on the lit side is more green.

I'm going to try a 4 hours on and 8 hours off cycle with both sides lit for the next 7-10 days, as I'm convinced of some light saturation of some sorts.

[nickq]

I've given up with it.
Perhaps I could get it to work by getting it to out compete the tank but above the tank the draining into the tank is too noisy, bubbly and splashy (on account of the bubbles).
I don't really have room for this design in my cabinet, so a sump + sm100 isn't going to work for me :(

[SantaMonica]

Wait for the new design then... should solve these problems.

[Floyd R Turbo]

And keep the LED lights as you may be able to re-use them on the new design - right SM?

[SantaMonica]

Yes if you build it to match the light.

[nickq]

Hi, been a while but I'm back. I still have the LEDs and on the cusp of ordering a HOG5 from SM.
Just wondering if anyone has ever dismantled the ehsine unit to see if you could re-use the LEDs? Seems a shame to waste these.
I've been scrubber less since my failure with the SM100 cone but I still believe in it as the way forward for my tank.
Any ideas?

Thanks,
Nick.

[Floyd R Turbo]

The e-shine unit, like other similar lights, is just a metal core PCB mounted directly to an aluminum plate, and the fans blow on the other side of the plate. So they are not individually mounted LEDs on stars. Therefore the only real use for them is in the form they are in. Removing them from the housing would only take the weight/form factor of the housing itself out of the equation, and you would still need to cool the aluminum heat sink (if you want to call it that) with fans so why bother.