Phosphate vs. Phosphorus

[Jason]

I would respectfully argue that proving the skimmate has phosphate in it, is not the same as proving the skimmer removed phosphate from the water.

So where's the sulfate coming from ????


I feel a better test would be to put a tank in a dark room, fill it up with water of a known phosphate level, then put in the skimmer and measure the phosphate of the water later.

Sounds good

[Jason]

Skimmers remove N/P
No, they don't

they just do it at an earlier stage when the compounds are in a state where they can attach to bubbles (larger food particles).
Food particles are not equal to N and P, any more than the smoke from a steak is equal to the steak. Skimmers remove the "steak", but leave the "smoke". Algae remove the "smoke", but leave the "steak".

Here is an analysis on wet and dry Skimmer skimmate : article (http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2010/2/aafeature)

[SantaMonica]

Pictures speak louder than words

You made my point. Phosphorus is not Phosphate.


.1 Phosphates and 25 nitrates on my Salifert nitrate test kit.

You are measuring Inorganic Phosphate, not Phosphorus. Try buying a test kit for Organic Phosphorus.


change the title of this forum to UPFLOW from UPLOW

Done.

[SantaMonica]

Now your talking semantics between phosphorus (the label on the food packaging) vs phosphate

If you think that phosphorus and phosphate are the same thing, you are in the wrong hobby.

[SantaMonica]

Thanks for making my point again.

[Jason]

Elemental phosphorus exists in two major forms—white phosphorus and red phosphorus—but due to its high reactivity, phosphorus is never found as a free element on Earth.

So it has to be PO4, thus what is in the skimmer's cup.

no ?

[SantaMonica]

Organic phosphorus.

[Jason]

http://karnet.up.wroc.pl/~weber/rys6.gif

To read this Article about organic/inorganic phoforus ine sea water (http://www.aslo.org/lo/toc/vol_32/issue_2/0383.pdf)

[Byron]

Wow, I didn't see this coming! I havn't been around here long but you SM & Ace have both helped me greatly! It would be a loss to all of us if you can not get beyond this!

[SantaMonica]

One of my favorite organic phosphorus things is garlic shrimp. However it is a bit expensive to feed your tank. Another favorite source of organic phosphorus is peanut butter; but it clogs up the feeding devices. My eel's favorite source of organic phosphorus is silversides. However the type of organic phosphorus that I feed most often is nori and sinking pellets.

Too bad our phosphate kits can't measure any of that organic phosphorus. Would be kind of neat to see how much organic phosphorus is going into the tank. I guess we are lucky that algae does not consume any organic phosphorus, or else the algae might grow to be as heavy as the rocks.

[jacob.morgan78]

The skimmate test in RODI water is not reliable. It could be that the skimmer is pulling out the food and the food is breaking down in the collection cup. The collection cup would be a perfect place for the stuff that the skimmer is pulling out to break down to phosphates...

[SantaMonica]

break down to phosphates

..to Inorganic Phosphate.