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View Full Version : Few questions for new reef tank.



Rawr
08-31-2009, 12:05 AM
Well just wanna start off and say this seems like the best thing to happen to any tank in a long time. Almost makes me wonder why everyone doesn't do something like this. Anyways I'm new to reefing and even saltwater always stayed away from it because of the high cost and just fear of the unknown. I've been in the process of researching and putting up a plan for a reef tank for a few months now but about a week ago I found out about ATS and its made me wanna jump right into it. Before reading this I was still gonna put off starting this for at least another few months. But now with this I feel like I'm ready for anything. The whole concept just seems so simple.
Now I have a few questions and because I feel like I gotta be missing some aspect of this. Is there anything I need to know about running this with no skimmer? is there anything I should keep an eye on?
there doesn't seem to be any Major cons from running this system except maybe cleaning it once a week it seems? Is there anything I should be wary of? And since I plan on starting right off with this kinda system is there anything you might suggest I do differently?
I'm going to check out stands and things later this week to see how much room I have to work with but currently Im thinking of building a horizontal scrubber to maximize sump space. Also I'm afraid of splashing and creating any salt creep which is the main reason I want a horizontal scrubber. Im just kinda lazy and I would hate to have to clean the salt creep underneath the tank where its hard to maneuver around. If someone could market that santamonica120 I would buy it in a heartbeat. the only reason I'm still gonna delay this another week or two is because I have to build this myself and search of parts in my area. My tank is hopefully gonna be a 40 breeder with a 29 gal sump and a 12 by 10 or 10 by 12 scrubber and possibly a one foot t5 if i can find one around that size. Would this be sufficient? Would a piece of acrylic in between the scrubber and light be alright? would this block out a certain % of usable light? like 5%?? i dunno
Hopefully I'll have pics and everything up in a few weeks! thanks for all your help! and also I'm amazed at how much work Santamonica has put into spreading the word on this incredible technique.

SantaMonica
08-31-2009, 12:33 PM
Welcome to the salt side of things. Will be easy to start with a scrubber, and design around it. Main thing to know is your start with, and keep, is strong lighting and flow.

Being a breeder tank, you probably still want to have a wet-dry, to keep the ammonia down, and also in case you mis-treat your algae. As for the scrubber. I'd go for twice the recommended screen size, which it looks like you did. However if you do single-sided, you have to double the size again. So I'd do a 160 sq inch horizontal, probably 9 X 18. And even if horizontal, the more slope, the better, because you want the fastest flow possible. Vertical is really the most space-saving, and there is no splash at all if you just put a acrylic box around it. But you can put acrylic over the horizontal too. Won't hurt. And, you could still have someone build the 120 for you if you wanted, the plans are posted up now.

Lighting: A 12" T5 is nowhere near enough. For a heavy load (breeder), you want 1 watt per gallon. If you do a 18" long scrubber, it would be perfect for (2) 24" long T5's, since the bulbs are really only 18" useable. This would be 48 watts.

Rawr
10-10-2009, 02:26 PM
Thanks for the response and Its taken me awhile but I Finally got things sortof set up
It took me a little while cause I kept changing my mind on tanks and had to keep waiting on the store to get it delivered.

Anyways heres some pictures of just the tank. Its a 65 gallon tank now and it has the same foot print as the 40 breeder tank
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/StDxbcs80uI/AAAAAAAAAQI/M-I_5pjMV0k/s720/DSC00137.JPG
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/StDxWqZcG7I/AAAAAAAAAQA/E1UOMHmv28A/s720/DSC00138.JPG
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/StDxXjhOsXI/AAAAAAAAAQE/hljSA-8unJc/s720/DSC00139.JPG

I haven't built the scrubber yet but I've ordered (Plastic Canvas 7 Mesh 10.5" x 13.5) and (Plastic Canvas 7 Mesh 12" x 18")
wasn't sure which size would be better so i got a bunch of both to make sure i have a few extra in case I fail miserably.
I haven't decided on which light to use. I think Im gonna start with a horizontal sheet and see how well that works maybe change it out for a vertical sheet in a month or two. Again dunno what lighting would be good for now and for when I switch to a vertical scrubber. The 24" T5s would fit nicely horizontally but i couldn't fit them vertically. So i might go with RAB PLF39 as you suggested in other threads.
Is there anything else you might suggest? something I may have missed?
Hopefully I can have the scrubber up and running by the end of this week. Thanks for all the info and help!

SantaMonica
10-11-2009, 11:53 AM
If you must have something that you know will work with a high load, do a vertical. Horizontals have too many variables that can slow the filtering later on when you really need it (like clumps of growth on the screen, which block flow). If you want to experiment now, before fish, that's fine. Increase your screen and wattage size to match the 65g.

Rawr
10-23-2009, 12:13 AM
Well had the horizontal scrubber running a few days but I'm unimpressed with it. Theres a bit of green algae growing on it but very minimal. I think its because theres not enough flow. Gonna attempt changing it into a vertical scrubber this weekend but I suspect its still not gonna be enough flow so i may change to the mag drive 9.5 if it still looks off.
I started one of the sheets in my tank with a powerhead pointed at it before I set up the the scrubber fully since I figured the halides would work pretty well on it. This is what it looks like after 5 days. But it looks better than the sheet in my sump
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SuFUNyLnP2I/AAAAAAAAAUA/59gtdlGGWfw/s640/DSC00161.JPG


I'm pretty sure that lights too far away from the sheet which is another reason I wanted to change to vertical since I can hook it up without worrying about it falling into the tank which It kinda looks like it might. Yeah this is the lazy mans way of doing it and it obviously failed.
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SuFTOiDL2bI/AAAAAAAAATk/Ad5Klmi_cuA/s640/DSC00160.JPG

Hopefully I'll have some pics of the finished vertical scrubber by Monday.

SantaMonica
10-23-2009, 04:24 AM
The sheet in the water won't doing anything... you can save yourself the time :)

Rawr
10-26-2009, 11:31 PM
Did you mean the one i kept in my tank with the power head? I see alot of things On it but now I'm starting to think it may just be debris thats just stuck to the screen lol. Well Everything in this is new to me and I apologize if I'm going against what has already been stated. Its just that I like to trial and error alot of things and after all my water tests have been zero (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate) I thought it might've been working. But I also do have tons of algae all over my tank so that may have been part of the reason. The screen in my sump has actually worked very well where there has been decent flow.
I overfilled my sump a little bit and half the screen was under water. That half of the screen is just completely clear so I understand the vertical scrubber would work much better for me. Again I was lazy this weekend so nothing was done but I swear sometime this week i'll have it completed. :lol:
one of my Worries is my friend gave me a few pieces of xenia (pom pom xenia i think) and I love them so much I wanted to get some silver tipped Xenia. They've grown like crazy so far but that may be because the scrubber isn't really working for me yet.
From what I've read on this site Xenia can't really be grown with the scrubber. Is there any way to keep and maintain a healthy colony of xenia if I dose iodine heavily or keep the scrubber off occasionally? Maybe keep the scrubber off for a day or two and just keep it submerged in water after I dose with iodine? I don't mind if the xenia doesn't grow after Its gotten to a decent size as long as it can maintain its size and doesn't die out. Would that happen? Whats your experience with it?

SantaMonica
10-27-2009, 06:49 AM
To keep xenia you have to greatly over-feed. Start with twice as much and go up from there. You can't run a scrubber part-time.

Rawr
10-28-2009, 01:31 AM
Just wanted to update with some more pictures.
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SufVvquIWyI/AAAAAAAAAVg/QL-vrIM4T9w/s640/DSC00173.JPG
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SufVTaHz8oI/AAAAAAAAAVE/YuY9jq-32Lw/s640/DSC00178.JPG
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/Suf6OVfxCzI/AAAAAAAAAWA/YYsU2-Hw4jA/s640/DSC00179.JPG

Now I just need to find a secure way to attach the lights. Since I'm not very handy do you have any suggestions on what might be a good way to do it? Something adjustable so I can move it closer or farther from the screen if necessary?
I was gonna try duct tape but I figured that wouldn't be very safe and a little unsightly.

SantaMonica
10-28-2009, 05:09 AM
Just use a clip-on CFL:

http://www.radio-media.com/fish/ClipOnLight.jpg


Also, if you let the screen hang all the way into the water, it will be quiet, with less bubbles.

Rawr
11-07-2009, 04:32 PM
Another update on things
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SvSxyIf-NSI/AAAAAAAAAY4/1ho8k9ta20Q/s640/DSC00192.JPG
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SvYKhyC763I/AAAAAAAAAZs/pvb6LmC8zug/s640/DSC00194.JPG
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SvYKkvqfz8I/AAAAAAAAAZw/86JQY-hFnGI/s640/DSC00195.JPG
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SvYKm6t0fWI/AAAAAAAAAZ0/IDo7ZK9XCzw/s640/DSC00196.JPG
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SvYKoo1ZmgI/AAAAAAAAAZ4/gvEfTxO-Plo/s640/DSC00197.JPG
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_6rzH_ijnpKA/SvYKrX-g_kI/AAAAAAAAAZ8/hWV-DgCu5sI/s640/DSC00199.JPG

Even though the Scrubber wasn't filled with algae I've still cleaned the dark brown slimey stuff every few days. Also I found some turf algae in some live rock I bought off craigslist. Ripped off a few small chunks and stuffed it in between the sheets hoping that it might do something. Since adding the scrubber the nasty brown algae or whatever it was has slowed its growth in my tank and I haven't seen any hair algae left on the rock I turned over.
Now my sun Coral hasn't opened up in a week or two and I'm starting to get worried. It used to open up every night and I could feed it then. I've tested just about everything with the API tests ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and it was zero. Also the API calcium test came out around 360 ppm. Should I start dosing for calcium? if so what do you suggest?

SantaMonica
11-07-2009, 07:52 PM
I think the sun is unrelated to the calcium. But since you are scrubbing, you can start looking into continous liquid feeders, which will keep the sun open all the time.