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nizz
08-30-2013, 04:38 PM
I had my scrubber on for a 6 days so far and this is what I have. I just increased the lighting from 18/6 to 20/4 yesterday. I did try to rub some hair algae in the scrubber. But, I don't think I did a good job and the progress still seems slow. I did take my protein skimmer, GFO, and carbon are all off line.

SantaMonica
08-30-2013, 05:03 PM
Welcome,

Since the growth is occurring further down away from the light, and at the drains which have the most flow, this seems like it is needing more nutrients. So reduce the light to 12 hours.

nizz
08-30-2013, 05:33 PM
Ok I will try that.

nizz
08-30-2013, 05:35 PM
Anything I need to look for if that is not enough time to either increase or decrease my lighting?

SantaMonica
08-30-2013, 08:26 PM
Always look to see if the growth in closer to or farther from the lights. This tells you what it is seeking.

Also pay attention to the water flow; up at the holes, and down at the drains. This is where the most nutrients will be.

nizz
08-31-2013, 09:52 AM
I have hair algae on my rocks. If I stop feeding algae sheets. Will the tangs start eating the algae on the rocks?

SantaMonica
08-31-2013, 10:13 AM
They probably are already.

Interestingly, once your scrubber grows and pulls nutrients out of the water, phosphate will start coming out of the rocks and will cause more (not less) algae to grow on the rocks, thus feeding the tangs more. This will occur for about six months.

And of course you can always feed the tangs from the scrubber, like I do. When they see the lid being raised (and the red light)... they come running for dinner.

nizz
08-31-2013, 11:56 AM
Well right now I have my scrubber in the sump. Do you think I will have a different affect if my scrubber was on top of the main tank and not in the sump?

SantaMonica
08-31-2013, 01:47 PM
No.

nizz
09-02-2013, 06:20 AM
here is a with 8/16 and the last picture was when the tank had been dark for 24 hrs.

SantaMonica
09-02-2013, 10:26 AM
I think I need to see a vid of the bubbles.

nizz
09-02-2013, 11:07 AM
http://youtu.be/AEB_QMNIb9U

Here is a short video of the bubbles.

SantaMonica
09-02-2013, 11:28 AM
Ok I reverse my opinion: You have high nutrients, and it's growing black, and it's trying to attach but when it does it gets knocked off by the bubbles. This is why the strings are bare; they are in the bubble patch. And the growth which is sticking is on the Green-Grabber textures, away from the strong bubbles.

So run the light 24 hours for a while. Don't clean it, and let it build up.

nizz
09-02-2013, 11:31 AM
Ok I will do that and continue with the pictures.

nizz
09-02-2013, 11:33 AM
Is this one of those times running 24hrs lights is needed lol

SantaMonica
09-02-2013, 02:23 PM
Maybe

nizz
09-03-2013, 03:50 PM
I was going to wait until friday. but, this picture show the most I have developed so far.

nizz
09-05-2013, 02:41 PM
Today I think I am getting cyano in my scrubber. Looks kind like there is a little red in there. I put the light at 22/2 starting yesterday. Figured I was going to get the same effect even if I kept them on for 24 hrs.

SantaMonica
09-05-2013, 05:59 PM
No it's starting to fill in, now that's it's getting enough light.

nizz
09-08-2013, 11:45 AM
More of my progress so far.

nizz
09-09-2013, 04:10 PM
Ok I am starting to see what looks like dark red in the scrubber. Is that a sign of a lot of nutrients in the tank?

SantaMonica
09-09-2013, 06:41 PM
It's fine; most new ones will get that. You can brush it off when harvesting later.

nizz
09-10-2013, 03:20 AM
Ok good. Well I am glad this thing is on the right track. Also I got a noticed that my other scrubber is at the post office yesterday. So I will be trying to pick that up soon.

nizz
09-13-2013, 03:36 PM
I feel like I need to turn down the lighting from 22/2 to 20/4 or maybe 18/6

SantaMonica
09-13-2013, 04:20 PM
No I think it's just time to clean. Take it to the sink this time.

nizz
09-13-2013, 04:28 PM
Ok I just put it in the sink to clean it. I didn't have a tooth brush to clean it. Just kind a used my finger.

SantaMonica
09-14-2013, 12:45 PM
Tape up one of the drain holes. This will recirculate the water even more.

nizz
09-14-2013, 07:07 PM
So blocking up one of the drains will help with growth in the scrubber?

SantaMonica
09-14-2013, 07:51 PM
It will keep water inside, which will allow the algae to bring the nutrients down to a level that more green can grow (green grows best in lower nutrients).

nizz
09-15-2013, 03:21 PM
Ok I plug one of the drains on both scrubbers. I will report back on the progress.

Greenchaos
09-16-2013, 07:40 AM
It will keep water inside, which will allow the algae to bring the nutrients down to a level that more green can grow (green grows best in lower nutrients).

That's confused me. I thought it was the tank he wanted filtering. So growing algae on rubbish water is no good, it's gotta be clean to grow?

SantaMonica
09-16-2013, 09:38 AM
GHA grows best in lower nutrient water.

nizz
09-18-2013, 06:25 PM
Here is a picture so far and it looks like I am getting more slim since I plugged one of the holes.

SantaMonica
09-18-2013, 07:59 PM
Yes but it's the growth at the surface, not the bottom, that matters. And the surface (on the rock) is much thicker. The growth is attaching to the rocks more, just like they attach at the beach. So it's going good.

nizz
09-19-2013, 04:52 PM
So I don't know if you answered my question. What's up with the clear slime in the scrubber? Because right now it looks like it's turning black where the air flowing through.

Greenchaos
09-19-2013, 05:08 PM
It's a bit sad when folks have spent $300 on summit that don't work :(

nizz
09-19-2013, 05:22 PM
I am sure my scrubber is working just fine.

Greenchaos
09-19-2013, 05:32 PM
I'm new but I thought the aim was to grow green algae, not slime. Perhaps it's got it's benefits though ;)

nizz
09-19-2013, 05:42 PM
Every system is different and I am pretty sure my system has a lot to pull out.

Greenchaos
09-19-2013, 05:48 PM
I'm lazy and ain't searched, but have you got a photo of your tank mate?

nizz
09-19-2013, 06:42 PM
Not on here. I might take one tomorrow or something. But keep in mined I have changed a few thing since putting the two scrubbers on my tank.

SantaMonica
09-19-2013, 08:02 PM
If you look at the example growth sequence pics I posted, you can see the slime around the edges. It's gone now, replaced by green. That is one of the purposes of the strings... to reach up to the water surface which is closer to the light, thus getting the most light possible. Stuff on the bottom is expected to be darker because it's shaded by the top. And soon, it will be blacked out by the top, as the growth on the strings gets stronger.

nizz
09-24-2013, 03:38 PM
This is what I have in my one of my scrubbers so far. Right now I have seen a drop in Hair algae but and increase in Cyano. Should I go ahead and clean the scrubber or should I still leave it the way it is for now?

SantaMonica
09-24-2013, 05:59 PM
Yep go ahead and get all the dark stuff out; you don't want anything shading the white surfaces.

nizz
09-24-2013, 07:19 PM
Ok I just clean that scrubber and put the plug back in one of the drains as we'll. The second scrubber I also have one of the drains plugged and so far the strings seems to be getting some algae on it while a little bit is on the walls. Still growing pretty slow. But I expected that since I have one scrubber going right now. Both are still running the LED at 22/2.

nizz
09-26-2013, 04:13 PM
So far this is what my scrubbers look like. Only one of them I had to clean. It looks like the hair algae is attached to the string. But growth seems slow now. Sad not I am getting more cyano on my sand and some over the hair algae that has be disappearing.

SantaMonica
09-26-2013, 04:26 PM
Natural progression, looks fine. Let them fill up now.

nizz
09-26-2013, 04:50 PM
Should I remove the plugs now or just continue to keep them in until the scrubber fills in?

SantaMonica
09-26-2013, 07:41 PM
Remove.

nizz
10-07-2013, 03:59 PM
It seems like I am getting more clear slime in my scrubber and some cyano. Instead of hair algae.

SantaMonica
10-07-2013, 05:58 PM
Pics

nizz
10-08-2013, 02:59 PM
I got a lot more of the clear slime you see in the picture from last week with cyano in it.

Greenchaos
10-08-2013, 03:10 PM
Yuk. I can see why you are concerned. These bubbly things do work though, don't they? If not, I'll try one of Floyds waterfall scrubbers.

nizz
10-08-2013, 04:45 PM
I am sure it works. Ever aquarium is different. So I am sure it's just my system and all the crap I had in it.

SantaMonica
10-08-2013, 06:31 PM
The "clear" is over-lit algae. Clean with a toothbrush and change to 18 hours.

nizz
10-15-2013, 04:33 PM
We'll it looks like I am started to grow algae in the scrubber and the tank seems to be doing better.

SantaMonica
10-15-2013, 07:42 PM
!!!

nizz
10-16-2013, 03:52 PM
This is what I have so far from both the scrubbers. I ran chem clean to get rid of the cyano I had in the tank and surprising enough it help clear the clear and red slime in my scrubbers.

SantaMonica
10-16-2013, 04:47 PM
Yes the chemi will do that; it does however put those nutrients back into the water.

If you are still running 22 hours, just keep it up and let's watch it develop.

nizz
10-16-2013, 07:45 PM
Actually I am running 18/4 from the last recommendation. So far that light schedule seems to work. Don't know if I should go back to 22/2 schedule with the red slime out of the scrubber now.

SantaMonica
10-16-2013, 08:14 PM
Just stay the same for a while.

Greenchaos
10-18-2013, 03:20 PM
I'm curious - considering your not exporting algae, are you waterchanging at all.

nizz
10-20-2013, 11:45 AM
Yes I have too.

nizz
10-21-2013, 06:36 PM
http://youtu.be/jr2YSmCyfTU

Here is life I found in one of my scrubbers

SantaMonica
10-21-2013, 07:25 PM
Nice

nizz
10-23-2013, 07:50 PM
My second scrubber seems to be white on the bottom still with the strings green. Should I turn down the lights of that scrubber for it to catch up? Maybe a 12/12 schedule for that one scrubber ?

SantaMonica
10-24-2013, 10:00 AM
Well that one might be a case of needing to shield the light with a stocking, but keeping the hours up.

nizz
10-24-2013, 04:42 PM
Ok I will try that

nizz
10-27-2013, 06:16 PM
I am trying something different with my second scrubber. I pulled a lot of hair algae from my overflow and put in my scrubber. Hoping I will get more growth by doing that.

nizz
11-12-2013, 03:47 PM
So it seems like I still can't grow any hair algae in my scrubbers. I even tried a stocking over the lamps and I still don't see any extra algae. Hell I an losing algae. So I am trying to turn down the photo phase.

SantaMonica
11-12-2013, 04:04 PM
Pics, display and tests would help

nizz
11-12-2013, 04:53 PM
I don't have any tests yet. But here is some pictures

nizz
11-12-2013, 04:54 PM
Pictures of the sump area

SantaMonica
11-12-2013, 05:12 PM
What is going on with that chaeto?

nizz
11-12-2013, 05:29 PM
What do you mean?

nizz
11-12-2013, 05:38 PM
More of the refugium

SantaMonica
11-12-2013, 06:43 PM
Why is it out of the water

nizz
11-12-2013, 06:52 PM
Haha it's not. That's a float refugium. The water level you are seeing is the water flowing around the refugium. I pump tank water into the refugium and the water from the refugium drop into where the scrubbers are.

SantaMonica
11-12-2013, 07:08 PM
I'm going to venture a guess that due to the clean sand and coralline, that P is coming out of the rocks in spots. And thus, nutrients are flowing into the scrubbers. And the chaeto is dying in the inside slowly, and supplying many more nutrients to the scrubber that just the rocks would, and thus the scrubbers are dark. In other words, the scrubbers have found a lot of easy-kill with the chaeto, and are being flooded with a high flow (not high level) of nutrients.

So I would remove the chaeto. Scrubber should then get brighter green, and, growth on the rocks should increase even more in the same spots as the P comes out even faster.

nizz
11-13-2013, 01:53 AM
I am starting to get algae on my sand too. You just can't see it from the picture. But regardless I will remove the cheato and see what happens. I kind a want to try a cpytic zone anyway.

Floyd R Turbo
11-13-2013, 05:42 AM
I would remove most of the chaeto but not all of it. Leave enough of the chaeto to do it's work in case there is something else going on that is preventing the scrubber from growing right.

But I also have to ask what is going on with that chaeto. It is 90% out of the water, how does it grow/survive like that? Does it get system water dripped over it or something? I wasn't following your explanation

nizz
11-13-2013, 04:41 PM
Don't let the throw you off. The cheato is completely under water. Hope this picture helps understand my floating refugium.

SantaMonica
11-13-2013, 07:58 PM
I'd still remove it. It's acting like a giant ball of nuisance algae that the scrubbers are trying to remove; thus, lots of nutrients flowing into the scrubbers, and thus dark slimey growth.

nizz
11-14-2013, 04:56 AM
We'll did remove 3/4 of the algae. You also don't see the ditrus that has settled in my sump alway. Going to work on trying to remove that as well. I drop the the lighting time to 16 hrs on because I am seeing white on the bottom of the scrubber and was thinking the light is too bright to allow the algae to grow at the moment.

Floyd R Turbo
11-14-2013, 07:13 AM
With chaeto or any macro that is grown in a fuge you need to trim it almost daily or every other day in order for it to be truly effective. For chaeto you need to rotate it to avoid shading. So having a giant ball does you little good, you want a small, mobile, fast growing ball that is constantly harvested. So yes trim the chaeto ball back to about softball size and once a day turn it over and give it a pull apart. Again, don't remove until the scrubber has proven itself.

With the white spots in the scrubber, this does indicate a lack of nutrients. What are your N and P readings?

SantaMonica
11-14-2013, 07:37 AM
White on the bottom is shading from the growth at the top. Needs more light.

nizz
11-14-2013, 09:06 AM
I will do a test this weekend and let you know.

I will also go ahead and increase the light again to see it that helps.

nizz
11-17-2013, 07:44 AM
Is the a sigh of lack of light or lack of nutrients?

SantaMonica
11-17-2013, 09:01 AM
The dark growth shows plenty of nutrients.

nizz
11-17-2013, 11:07 AM
What about the beige I am seeing now

SantaMonica
11-17-2013, 11:31 AM
I don't know. Just let it grow a week.

nizz
11-22-2013, 04:59 PM
This is what my scrubbers look like now. Kind a brown and black. So I am taking that means a lot of junk in the tank and the scrubber is pulling it out.

Floyd R Turbo
11-22-2013, 05:20 PM
So it's been well over 2 months now, have you tested your N and P? Instead of looking at the algae and drawing a conclusion about what might be going on, you need to run a test and find out where things are at. Because something is not working right.

nizz
11-22-2013, 06:15 PM
P= .46
Nitrate=25ppm
Nitrite= 0ppm

SantaMonica
11-22-2013, 06:46 PM
You are now getting dark growth from higher nutrients; max the lights out now at 22 hours.

nizz
11-22-2013, 06:49 PM
See that's why I don't do test. Because I already know my tank has high nutrients. But my light are on for 22 hrs a day for I think a couple weeks now.

Floyd R Turbo
11-22-2013, 07:57 PM
I would not say that your tank has overly high nutrients.

SM, you are directly contradicting what you state in your product description page, that the SURF creates a low-nutrient environment within a high nutrient system, and that's why it is capable of fast initial growth.

http://algaescrubber.net/forums/showthread.php?2794-SantaMonica-SURF2


First, the enclosed growth compartment increases the dwell time of the water and bubbles inside the unit so that they rub the algae many times before leaving the compartment. This actually reduces nutrients (nitrate, phosphate) to a level lower than the outside water, which allows greener growth to occur sooner (lower nutrients grows greener algae) inside the unit, especially in high-nutrient aquarium water. In other words, the SURF2 creates a lower-nutrient ecosystem inside itself which is different from the rest of the water in your aquarium.

I also recall you stating elsewhere that the 14 days growth from day zero is in a tank with high nutrients. So at least we know that this type of growth process is not true in all cases. I have UAS units on 2 tanks with nutrient levels close to what you're running at Nizz and I get tons of GHA. So something else is going on here, there is value in testing.

I got the most growth out of my UAS units when I stopped feeding and let the scrubbes pull the nutrients down. One was able to pull N down to zero, but not P - it's still there. The other just really got going and it a temp system anyways.

So my suggestion is to cut your feeding down to almost nothing - tank/corals/fish in 'survival' mode, and let the scrubbers get started. Worked for me. My L2 UAS test unit never grew that great until I did this (I also removed the fish, except for a goby)

nizz
11-22-2013, 08:25 PM
Well I stop feeding seaweed sheet for so the fox face, Sailfin, and Coral beauty would eat the algae on the rocks. All I am feeding now is 2 cubes of mysis a day ( 1 in the morning and 1 in the even ). They are the 3.5oz cubes. I guess I can just knock that down to once a day. I thought about getting the 1.5 oz cubes thinking I am feeding too much. Since I have a bangi cardinal, clarkii clown, and watchmen goby as well. But my Sailfin and fox face are pretty big. But I will try one cube a day and see if that helps.

Now some of the things I have changed. I was dosing dr Tim's waste away. Which I think cause the algae in the scrubber to disappear. But I am stopping as of last weekend.



I replaced the sponge filter for a filter sock (200 micron). I will be sucking up the detritus in the sump that the foam sponge didn't pick up. I guess I will see how it goes. I am sure I still have a long road ahead of me.

SantaMonica
11-23-2013, 09:42 AM
Well it was on the right road before; any help you can give it will help the GHA attach inside it.

nizz
11-23-2013, 04:40 PM
Well I will report on Friday on how the scrubbers are doing and a test from the tank. But so far the scrubbers are getting really dark. So I think that's from the high nutrients. I tried to remove the detritus from the sump. So that will help things.

SantaMonica
11-23-2013, 06:52 PM
My next guess is that the system might need to stabilize after removing the chaeto.

Cleaning the sump and anything else that is trapping particles will help.

nizz
11-23-2013, 07:01 PM
I hope so

SantaMonica
11-23-2013, 07:36 PM
Did you take all the chaeto out, or leave some in?

nizz
11-24-2013, 04:37 AM
I left a small ball in. But I might as well take it out because I am not lighting it.

SantaMonica
11-24-2013, 09:05 AM
Well yes, it would just be adding to the load. However in the spirit of helping thing start, you could leave it and light it.

Are you dosing any carbon?

nizz
11-24-2013, 09:18 AM
I am not dosing anything to the tank. Monthly water changes to supplement

nizz
11-24-2013, 09:22 AM
Since I change my filter sponge to a filter sock. That has help catch everything so far. My elegance seems to be doing better now. Now I just want to be able to grow SPS.

SantaMonica
11-24-2013, 01:51 PM
Well let's just get back to where it was before:
http://algaescrubber.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4872&d=1381963858

Greenchaos
11-24-2013, 02:22 PM
Well let's just get back to where it was before:
http://algaescrubber.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4872&d=1381963858

Why does this box seem to favour unicellular growth, instead of GHA?

nizz
11-24-2013, 03:07 PM
I just pulled the rest of the cheato out. It was about to be gone anyway.

nizz
11-25-2013, 03:59 PM
Since I start syphoning the detritus from the sump and refugium. My Ph start going higher.

SantaMonica
11-25-2013, 06:59 PM
Yes decaying food particles consume oxygen and release CO2.

nizz
11-26-2013, 04:28 PM
So I saw I have some detritus in the scrubbers from me trying to remove the detritus from the sump. Used a tooth brush to clean them. So I hope that will help it grow better.

SantaMonica
11-26-2013, 05:52 PM
Not a big deal. Main thing is to give it time to work.

nizz
11-29-2013, 10:00 AM
P= .49
Nitrate = 25-50 ( it's a tosh up on the chart)
Nitrite = 0

This is where I am at this week

nizz
11-29-2013, 01:08 PM
This is what the scrubbers look like this week.

nizz
11-29-2013, 02:41 PM
My tank has a lot of nutrients. That gunk is from all the nutrients in my tank. My tank still needs to equal out.

SantaMonica
11-29-2013, 04:15 PM
Another user tried brushing all the dark off, and it immediately starting growing green. Probably because the green can't attach through the slime. You might try this.

nizz
11-30-2013, 05:24 AM
I can try to re-brush it again to see if that will help the grow.

SantaMonica
11-30-2013, 09:18 AM
After that, just let it sit and grow.

nizz
11-30-2013, 09:43 AM
This is what they look like before I cleaned them.

nizz
11-30-2013, 09:44 AM
This is what they look like when I cleaned them. I hope they are cleaned enough to grow algae.

nizz
11-30-2013, 01:15 PM
Decided to protein skimmer back on. I was to see if it will help the scrubber algae right. Also, I will be tearing this tank down in a month to a month and a half. It's not permanent. Just deploying. I still want to see if this scrubber idea is the way to go for me.

RkyRickstr
12-02-2013, 12:36 PM
Please Keep in mind this is not the only type of scrubber. Dont categorize them. Waterfall might have better results for you like it did for me.

nizz
12-02-2013, 05:08 PM
trust me I have thought about making a waterfall type. but I just don't have the room for that kind a scrubber without causing a lot of bubble getting in the main tank. I am going to check the scrubbers friday and see how things are. So far my PH is slowing going up and the skimmer has calm down.

SantaMonica
12-02-2013, 07:15 PM
One of my units started doing like yours after I tripled the feeding; I just left it to grow, and after two weeks green was once again sprouting through the dark stuff.

nizz
12-07-2013, 09:18 AM
Phosphate - .10
Nitrate -25
Nitrite - 0

SantaMonica
12-07-2013, 12:42 PM
Seems the right direction.

nizz
12-07-2013, 02:31 PM
And this is what the scrubbers look like right now.

nizz
12-07-2013, 02:32 PM
Also I want to note my tank as some short algae all over the rocks at the moment

SantaMonica
12-07-2013, 03:56 PM
Another toothbrushing the dark stuff would help.

nizz
12-07-2013, 06:03 PM
I just brushed them. This time it was a lot harder to clean that stuff off.

nizz
12-14-2013, 08:19 AM
Phosphate - .12
Nitrite - 0 ppm
Nitrate - 25 ppm

SantaMonica
12-14-2013, 10:39 AM
Let it just continue to fill in.

nizz
12-14-2013, 11:11 AM
Ok

richiero
12-20-2013, 09:12 AM
is it working ? i need to know b4 i drop 300 bucks

nizz
12-20-2013, 05:18 PM
Well here is a picture as of a few mins ago. Algae is starting to grow in the scrubber finally. I think the skimmer and filter socks have helped. But the tank still have algae everywhere. I am willing to bet once the scrubber start to grow a lot of algae. The tank will start looking better. But in all fairness. I still am breaking down the tank in January due to military reasons. So I want to see how things work until then.

nizz
12-20-2013, 05:56 PM
Also take from this thread that every tank is different. It could have be me preventing scrubber from working with my newbish attempts.

richiero
12-20-2013, 08:39 PM
wanna sell you scrubber?

nizz
12-21-2013, 04:47 AM
No

nizz
12-21-2013, 08:57 AM
I plan to use them for my live rocks that will be cooking while I am gone.

richiero
12-21-2013, 09:27 AM
how do you like the product ? do you feel that it helped you system? if so i might just get one..

nizz
12-21-2013, 10:37 AM
St the moment I think my system is balancing out. I have a lot of nutrients in the tank and these scrubbers is slow to pull them out. I think my problem was pulling the skimmer off as soon as I put the scrubbers on.

nizz
12-24-2013, 02:17 PM
Santa Monica. Have you looked into putting air channels for the air tubes to guide all the air into the scrubber? Mine seems escape and not all the air bubble go into the scrubber.

SantaMonica
12-24-2013, 03:16 PM
Check for water flow under it; if a powerhead is blowing hard, it will blow the bubbles sideways.

nizz
12-24-2013, 04:24 PM
Oh ok.

nizz
12-28-2013, 06:43 AM
So far I noticed that moving the scrubbers from one sector to a different sector. Change how the scrubber performs

SantaMonica
12-28-2013, 10:08 AM
I believe it. They can vary greatly. My 4 units in the same water are sometimes completely different.

108rockhurst
01-02-2014, 07:51 AM
I believe it. They can vary greatly. My 4 units in the same water are sometimes completely different.


This is true, at least for me anyway. I have had 1 in my display for about 3 months, and it takes 3 weeks to get decent growth. The growth is dark and has some cyano in it. It also doesn't hold real well. I can rinse it out easily. Run light 18 hours.
I put one in my sump 2 weeks ago, it is full of bright green hair algae that is very hard to remove from the strings and the green grabber material. Run light 18 hours on a sort of opposing cycle to the one in display.
I might put the display one on the other side of tank(left) and see what happens.
I am just thrilled that the one in the sump is working so well.
Oh, by the way, I took skimmer out when I started using the surf2's.
My devils finger(NPS) is growing fast, but my plate coral died. I don't know if it had anything to do with the scrubber as opposed to the skimmer.
My tank is a 120gal.

nizz
01-06-2014, 07:28 PM
I will take some pictures friday. But I can see some algae growth in the scrubbers. But I have a good bit of algae in my main tank. So I know that is making my process slow. But, before I go. I plan to darken the tank. So we will see how everything turns out. Funny thing is the algae in the main tank is not getting long. The tangs must be keeping them well trimmed. lol

SantaMonica
01-06-2014, 08:29 PM
Whenever I have slow-to-start growth like yours, I just let it sit, and it eventually starts up.

nizz
01-10-2014, 05:39 PM
What my scrubbers look like now

nizz
01-10-2014, 07:16 PM
Also good new. I won't be breaking down my tank. My girlfriend said she will take care of the tank while I am gone. So it looks like the scrubbers will have more time to mature.

SantaMonica
01-10-2014, 07:53 PM
I have a theory that excess silicates might be allowing diatoms to grow, and they don't attach well. Are you running GFO now?

nizz
01-11-2014, 06:45 AM
No I am not running any filtration besides a skimmer and socks

SantaMonica
01-11-2014, 11:07 AM
Well some GFO might help to remove those silicates if indeed the theory is correct.

nizz
01-12-2014, 04:26 PM
So I need to run GFO now?

SantaMonica
01-12-2014, 05:18 PM
Might be a good test.

nizz
02-21-2014, 04:50 PM
So I haven't updated much. But I started run alcohol in my tank for about a month now and my hair algae is almost gone within my display tank. The scrubbers really never took off with algae at all. They will stay on the tank while I am deployed. But I think the algae scrubber wasn't right for my tank and setup.

nizz
08-07-2014, 12:50 PM
Ok I just came back from my deployment. I am bumping this thread again because of the resolute from the scrubbers. I still have the vodka on the system to help curve nutrients. When has giving me the quickest and best resolute so far. Well after six month deployment. My gf has be maintaining my tank. Which means no water changes, feeding the fish once a day and cleaning the filters socks when needed and cleaning the protein skimmer when it's full. The scrubbers have had the lights on for 24hrs and never harvest since I was having problems in that department. Well this is the resolute of that.

nizz
08-07-2014, 12:51 PM
Want to add. These unit produce a lot of salt crusts around the edges for sure.

SantaMonica
08-07-2014, 06:58 PM
Well that's pretty amazing, for the left one anyway. Would love to find the difference between it and the right one.

Yes the SURF2 and SURF2x do have a little sputtering out of the top (SURF4 does not), which one user found he could stop by putting a little bit of cloth around the edge. I don't do it as a regular step because many folks don't seem to mind when it's in the sump, and all they do is push the scrubber under water once a week to clean it. Might be an improvement to look into however.

While you were away, I pretty much resolved why the growth stayed black in yours (and a few others)... the light (4 LEDs) was too weak for the amount of phosphate in the water. Thus the growth was dark and got blown away by the super strong bubbles. So I'm now recommending the SURF2x (6 LEDs) when the water is over 0.2 ppm phosphate. In your case the vodka brought the levels down to where the one scrubber could go green; once there, the re-circulating water inside the scrubber kept the phosphate low. I'll bet there are lots of pods in there too.

Anyways, a toothbrush scrub on the other one should get it going too, although it looks like weak lighting; maybe it's timer is different. Once it's growing, you should be able to stop the vodka slowly.

nizz
08-07-2014, 11:01 PM
The other scrubbed is on the same timer as the other one. I was thinking the one that took off might be taking up some of the load and the other one doesn't really have anything between the vodka, skimmer, aqua socks, and one scrubber. But I will clean them and see what happens.

nizz
08-07-2014, 11:02 PM
So with the algae being light green like that on the one that took off. You think the lighting is too much?

SantaMonica
08-08-2014, 02:59 AM
Loads are the same; there is no difference where it goes in the sump or system because the amount of nutrients removed by algae is very small and localized to just the layer of water touching it. Only after repeated passes of water, over a long time, does a lot of nutrients get removed. This is why larger flow does not help.

Something else is different with the second scrubber. It looks exactly like a weak light.

nizz
08-08-2014, 03:15 AM
I will try and wipe down the front of the LEDs. Since they haven't been touch. Also a water change hasn't been done in 6 months. Which I will do to replace the essentials.

nizz
08-08-2014, 08:07 AM
Also wondering since I have 2 scrubbers if getting the surf4 a and sell the 2 surf2's would be better.

SantaMonica
08-08-2014, 10:05 AM
Two small units is always better than one big, so that one is always filtering after cleaning the other.

For a tank with P over 0.2 it would be better to have two SURF2x units, since each unit has 6 LEDs to handle the P. This is the equivalent of a SURF4 with 12 LEDs which is not available (SURF4 has 8 LEDs). However your P is probably in control now, and periphyton has developed on the rocks to help too, so your 4-LED units will probably do the job.

Just don't move the rocks, or change flow, so the periphyton stays alive.

nizz
08-08-2014, 04:00 PM
So the setting I had the scrubber on was a 22hrs day setting. You think that's too much compared to the color of the algae from one of the units ?

SantaMonica
08-08-2014, 04:33 PM
No that's good.

nizz
08-11-2014, 04:08 PM
so its still good to have a lot of air flow in the scrubbers?

SantaMonica
08-11-2014, 05:14 PM
Yes.

nizz
08-18-2014, 12:54 PM
I think I might have found why that one scrubber wasn't doing well. That scrubbers light was plugged into a port that was on 24/7. I am thinking since their was no rest period is didn't do well. Not sure though. That was the only differences so far.

SantaMonica
08-19-2014, 08:54 AM
Yes that's probably it. Set it to 18 hours and cover 2/3 of the light with a t-shirt.

nizz
11-24-2014, 05:30 PM
So I don't think 2 SURF2's is enough for my tank. I would like to upgrade to the SURF4's. Just wondering is the SURF4's have the bubble rings and low power setting for the LEDs?

SantaMonica
11-25-2014, 02:20 PM
Yes the SURF4 have bubble rings, and a two-power-supply setup, so that only one of them can be plugged in to provide low power (half the LEDs).

Also note that the brand new SURF8 is now available, and if it fits, might be another option for you:

http://www.santa-monica.cc/SURF8-floating-surface-2-compartment-Ribbon-Scrubber-with-Green-Grabber-surfaces--8-cubes-feeding-per-day_p_64.html

nizz
11-25-2014, 09:22 PM
I saw the surf 8. But don't think I like that option. My sink isn't big enough for some like if I have to clean it. But I will let you know when I buy a set of SURF4's

nizz
11-28-2014, 10:02 AM
Just wondering if it's normal to have coralline on the strings and do I need to clean them off?

SantaMonica
11-28-2014, 10:57 AM
It happens sometimes (to mine too). Does not really hurt or help, since algae attaches well to it anyway.

Dissolving it off with vinegar will work, but will also remove some algal roots.

nizz
01-16-2015, 03:55 PM
Ok I put my scrubbers back on. I am doing two 30gal water changes every two weeks and carbon dosing. My nitrates are still around 14ppm. I replace my filter sick every 3 day regardless if they need them or not. Also I have the two scrubber still on 22 hrs a day with alternating lights out between the two to kind a have a 24/7 scrubbing if you will. This is a week on the tank again

SantaMonica
01-16-2015, 05:28 PM
First thing to check, of course, is to watch the lights actually go out when they are supposed to.

nizz
01-16-2015, 05:36 PM
They do. I actually did see that. I purposely alternated there off cycle. That way the tank has a 24/7 scrub kind a thing. Ex: scrubber 1 is on from 12:00pm to 10:00am. While scrubber 2 is on from 14:00 to 12:00 both with 2hrs off cycle.

SantaMonica
01-16-2015, 06:40 PM
Ok then set the timer to 18 hours instead of 22. Cover the lights half way, and let run a week.

nizz
01-16-2015, 07:02 PM
It's been awhile since I had to cover up my lights. But what are you recommending to use to cover the lights? Panty-hoes still?

SantaMonica
01-16-2015, 07:27 PM
That or a t-shirt.

nizz
01-23-2015, 03:43 PM
Ok back at it again. This one week with the LED's covered and reduced lighting duration.

SantaMonica
01-23-2015, 03:55 PM
Ok looks like a good start. Remove the shirt, but keep at 18 hours for another 10 days.

nizz
01-30-2015, 03:50 AM
Ok this is where I am as of this morning. Does everything seem to be on track?

SantaMonica
01-30-2015, 09:38 AM
It's certainly filling in, although I'd like to see it much faster. You could do 20 hours now.

nizz
01-30-2015, 09:44 AM
Ok I will try that

nizz
02-06-2015, 09:55 AM
What my scrubbers look like with the increase time.

SantaMonica
02-06-2015, 10:40 AM
I'm going to send you a light from a SURF2x to try on one of the scrubbers, just in case the solution is as simple the amount of light.

You might recall you first got them going when it was left on 24 hours by mistake:

http://algaescrubber.net/forums/showthread.php?2905-My-SURF2-progress&p=36320&viewfull=1#post36320

nizz
02-06-2015, 11:55 AM
Yes I remember that. I am doing more water changes to try and bring the nitrates down. So far I am right around 12-16ppm.

nizz
02-08-2015, 01:12 PM
I went ahead and cleaned the airtubes with vingear on the scrubbers last night. I also did a lite scrubbing with a tooth brush also. So if the scrubbers look lite on the next time I take a picture. That maybe why or maybe that will make the scrubbers fill in more. I just had a few spot with brown goo on them.

nizz
02-09-2015, 03:52 PM
I just received the SURF 2X light. Do you still want me to run the lights at 20 hrs?

SantaMonica
02-09-2015, 04:26 PM
Yes, so that the only difference is the brighness.

nizz
02-10-2015, 04:42 PM
The one on the left is the old lights. The one on the right is the new. I am noticing a little green slime happening on the tips of the string. Will that be something to brush off this Friday?

SantaMonica
02-10-2015, 05:00 PM
Not sure. Let's see how it goes.

nizz
02-13-2015, 02:23 AM
Left old and right new light.

SantaMonica
02-13-2015, 09:43 AM
Can you stop the carbon dosing? That is known to slow down or stop scrubbers.

nizz
02-13-2015, 10:20 AM
I was about to mention that. I actually stop carbon dosing on Monday when the light came in.

nizz
02-15-2015, 06:45 AM
I feel like I am creating an experimint on the primatial ooze. Also, right is old light and left is new light.

SantaMonica
02-15-2015, 09:02 AM
Well I think that light is not the issue.

When you were gone for months, what was different in top-offs and water changes?

nizz
02-15-2015, 09:29 AM
Water changes didn't happen while I was deployed. The water top may had some high TDS as my wife never purge the RODI. So that added to my nutrient issue. Also I know my carbon dosing quit on me due to a clogged tube.

Now I am doing two week water changes of about 30gals each. I am making sure the TDS is zero when adding to my top off water and my water changing.

SantaMonica
02-15-2015, 09:44 AM
Yours is another case of carbon dosing occurring during low-growth. Let's see how it goes since you stopped dosing.

nizz
02-15-2015, 09:56 AM
Well do. My goal is to stop using my skimmer as well. I really don't think that thing is doing the job required of it (being too larger). Just idles (a lot)or skims wet. But I will wait until these starts up before I take it offline.

nizz
02-20-2015, 04:57 AM
Old light on the left and new light on the right. Algae is a thick ball of goo to me.

SantaMonica
02-20-2015, 11:11 AM
Well you can toothbrush out some more nutrients now.

How is your top-off and w/c tds?

nizz
02-20-2015, 12:46 PM
still zero. I am back on track with that. But, I am thinking of removing my skimmer this water change. It idles too much.

SantaMonica
02-20-2015, 05:15 PM
Well I'd say just let it sit and grow, like it did when you were gone. Something is slowing it down and maybe it will let up.

nizz
02-21-2015, 05:51 AM
Well I have three things going on with my tank now that could be slowing the scrubbers down at the moment. Water changes, carbon reactor, and protein skimmer.

SantaMonica
02-21-2015, 10:38 AM
None of those should affect it. But something is indeed in the water, and coming from somewhere.

What are you feeding?

nizz
02-21-2015, 11:38 AM
Right now mysis, nori, tetra veggie flakes, and Neptune crossover pellets. All are not feed all at once. Generally three of any combo

nizz
02-22-2015, 06:09 AM
I forgot about my overflows. They have been acting as scrubber since I had the tank. Takes them awhile to grow. But I do pull some good portions of algae from there.

nizz
02-22-2015, 07:22 AM
Just pull these this morning after my water chance. Mind you I have two overflows.

SantaMonica
02-22-2015, 10:25 AM
More reason to just let the scrubbers run without cleaning, like the overflows do, and like when you were gone.

nizz
02-22-2015, 10:53 AM
Well I am going to put a cover on the overflows to block the light. You think the overflows causing the scrubbers to act slower?

SantaMonica
02-22-2015, 12:09 PM
No, but the fact that they had forever to develop there, in lower light, could be a clue. Especially since the stronger scrubber light did not help.

SantaMonica
02-24-2015, 03:35 AM
Might be a good time to try dosing iron, such as Kent's Iron+Manganese.

nizz
02-24-2015, 05:15 AM
I have magnesium. Will that help?

Bacon
02-24-2015, 06:50 AM
Not magnesium, manganese. It's the iron you want out of the Kent's product, the manganese I don't know what that does

nizz
02-24-2015, 06:56 AM
Ok I will look for that. I will need to buy the test kit as well.

Bacon
02-24-2015, 07:06 AM
Should not need any test kit. It's hard to OD on iron, there's some old thread on here I remember where Santa dosed something like a half gallon into a 90g tank.

nizz
02-24-2015, 08:46 AM
That's crazy I would figure you could over dose any supplement in a reef. Well I was wanting to order a neptunes doser anyway. I will let you know when I get it setup.

Bacon
02-24-2015, 09:05 AM
Not saying you can't overdose. But iron gets sucked up pretty quickly. I think Santa's test did some damage to the tank which I think was kind of a test so I wouldn't do that but you can dose a LOT and be pretty safe.

SantaMonica
02-24-2015, 10:15 AM
Algae uses mostly Iron. Lots of nori would do it too. But you'll not be able to test for it.

nizz
02-24-2015, 02:41 PM
No problem. I ordered my new doser and two little fishes iron & manganese concentrate. Should be here Friday.

nizz
02-27-2015, 05:29 AM
Old light on the left and new light on the right. The picture doesn't show it well but the old light algae looks really dark green.

nizz
02-27-2015, 05:37 AM
Also can you push too much air within the scrubber?

SantaMonica
02-27-2015, 01:20 PM
Can't have too much air.

nizz
02-27-2015, 01:28 PM
On a different note. The green slime it still fine. Still on the right track?

SantaMonica
02-27-2015, 01:38 PM
I don't know. will have to see what develops.

nizz
02-27-2015, 02:09 PM
Have you seen this stage before?

SantaMonica
02-27-2015, 03:05 PM
Yes but when you brush it off it usually fills in with green hair. Maybe whatever is in the water will slowly come out like it did last time.

nizz
02-27-2015, 03:58 PM
Alright I just added my doser to the system. Will be dosing 7mL throughout the day. Let's see if that will help. On the bright side. I read iron helps with coral growth also. Mainly the green corals.

nizz
03-04-2015, 11:30 AM
Normally I was going to post this on Friday. But, since adding the iron. This is what my scrubbers are producing. Old light on the left. New light on the right.

nizz
03-04-2015, 11:31 AM
Do I need to wash this out or just let it keep going?

SantaMonica
03-04-2015, 12:47 PM
Looks the same. Let's do this:

Since it is doing a good job of growing thick nutrient-rich growth, toothbrush them both totally clean whenever they fill up like this. This way you'll at least be pulling these nutrients out, since they seem to want to come out.

nizz
03-09-2015, 12:18 PM
What's a good pump upgrade to replace my fusion pumps? Something a little bigger then needed for SURF. But not the coral lifter pumps. One of my fusion pumps leg of air is lacking. I think it's about to crap out on me.

SantaMonica
03-09-2015, 01:26 PM
The Hailea ACO-9720:
http://pentairaes.com/low-cost-outdoor-air-pumps.html

And here is a comparison video:
http://youtu.be/dLAv1Zo9fYM

If the new-rubber scent will be a problem, just run it outside for a few weeks first.

nizz
03-09-2015, 01:37 PM
Does this come with a four way port?

SantaMonica
03-09-2015, 01:58 PM
Comes with a 10-way port (plastic).

You can glue-shut the remaining ports, or get a 4-way from ebay ("4 outlet plastic air divider"), or I can mail one to you.

Even the smaller pump is very powerful, but almost silent if you set it on a concrete floor.

nizz
03-09-2015, 02:06 PM
Does it come with tubing also?

nizz
03-09-2015, 02:07 PM
Or can I get the tubing at Lowe's

nizz
03-09-2015, 02:12 PM
Ok nevermind. I see it comes with some 3/8 tubing. I think Lowe's has some four port manifold.

Different question. Will the smaller pump work well with two SURF4'S?

SantaMonica
03-09-2015, 03:43 PM
Yes easily.

nizz
03-12-2015, 01:51 PM
Here is my set up with the new air pump

nizz
03-12-2015, 01:56 PM
http://youtu.be/CFJj3CHlVVM

A link to see briefly how it started off

SantaMonica
03-12-2015, 04:31 PM
Mega bubbles.

nizz
03-12-2015, 04:37 PM
I am thinking I should have started out with this pump from the start.