View Full Version : I had to do it
Okay I had to build this. I saw and followed the thread at RC and I sort of followed it at RF. They were both closed and I have left this thought to fester in my head. I am new to this hobbie and am shortly comming to my 1 year anniversary in the hobbie. I have built my scrubber out of a piece of tile. I figured the porous material would lend a nice surface for the algae to grow. I found a piece of tile that is almost smooth on the back. It has ridges instead of criss cross paterns. It is perfect IMO and it just so happens to be the perfect size. I have a Bio Cube 29G. The tile measures 7x9 ish. I have scrapped off the pain on the back wall so it lights up through the glass. I will post pics as soon as I can. I am still in the Fred Flinstone days of cameras and my digital camera takes 3.5" hard disks. My PC has recently suffered a problem and now I have a new lap top. Wich doesn't take those disks. Anyway I hope you can follow my design.
SantaMonica
12-29-2008, 09:36 AM
You are using another light on the back of the tank, shining in through the glass, right?
Yes that is correct. I set it up on the 25th and I am starting to see the first signs of growth this morning. It is a small amount but it is starting to grow. How established to you think I have to get the scrubber before I pull out my chaeto?
Okay, some pics. As I said I don't have a good camera so I borrowed my daughters. It is a cheap one so not the best but you will get the idea.
this is the side shot of the tank,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/PICT0693.jpg
the fixture is a yard spike for lighting up trees, bushes, ect...
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/PICT0694.jpg
as close as i could get with this camera,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/PICT0701.jpg
a different angle. You might notice that the input from the first chamber has been blocked. I have cut a notch in the back wall to allow the water to flow into the middle chamber from the display over the top. I did this some time ago to increase my surface skimming ability. It just so happens that it is a great mod to allow this scrubber to work very well from what i can tell. I get a nice even sheet of water over the entire tile.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/PICT0702.jpg
The white stuff on top is filter floss to make the water cascade down and not splash. It also makes this completly silent. The only thing I hear on my tank is the fans cooling the lights. I guess we will see if this works or not.
Madeley
12-29-2008, 12:52 PM
Hi, That bulb looks very small, what size is it in watts?
You would be correct, it is only 9 watts. I know it isn't the usual size bulb. I have been growing my chaeto with it and it doubles in size every week so I thought I would give it a try. I already have another bulb I just wanted to see what this one would do if anything. So far it is growing. The spots I saw this morning have doubled in size and there are more little ones forming. The K rating on this bulb is 5750.
What fun is doing something the same way others have? Also, I look at every tank different. What works for one may not work quite as well for others. Since I have a non traditional set up I thought I would play around. If this bulb works then I see no reason to go to more watts and burn more energy. If I am wrong about this please some one tell me.
I am getting fair growth I think for not seeding. Tomorrow will be one week.
Does anyone know if these scrubbers will remove silicates?
Can these scrubbers cure (so to speak) live rock? What I mean is instead of someone having to remove thier rock to cook it, can this remove the phosphates.
Patrick Pending
12-30-2008, 06:41 PM
Does anyone know if these scrubbers will remove silicates? - I presume you have a problem with diatoms in your tank. Diatoms may grow on the screen and they may grow on the algae on the screen but the algae won't make much difference to the silicates. Although, as the algae use up the excess phosphate it will then limit diatom growth. In the meantime keep hoovering the diatoms from the gravel with a siphon-vac.
Can these scrubbers cure (so to speak) live rock? What I mean is instead of someone having to remove thier rock to cook it, can this remove the phosphates. - Yes.
BTW if you cook live rock you get dead rock!
Cheers,
Pat. Pending
Yes I do have a problem with diatoms and HA. The diatoms have never been an issue on the substrate just on the glass. As for the HA after doing everything I was told I am not getting anywhere fast, so I built a scrubber. I guess short of the silicates it will rid me of the other unwanted nasties. Should I take some of the HA and rub it into the scrubber or will it get there soon enough?
Also I have been thinking of adding some airation to my tank. Will this help or hinder the scrubber. It seems that it would hurt.
Patrick Pending
12-31-2008, 05:09 AM
The diatoms have never been an issue on the substrate just on the glass - Their silica skeletons do end up in the substrate though and can provide the raw materials for further generations. Having said that, my understanding is that reducing phosphates is the best way of controlling diatoms - t is difficult to eliminate silicates from the water as there are so many sources.
BTW: it occurred to me that the tile that you used in your scrubber may be a source of silicates.
I wouldn't bother rubbing the hair algae in if you already have some growth.
I can only see benefits to increased gas exchange, so I don't think aeration will hurt your scrubber,
Cheers,
Pat. Pending
You may have a point about the tile. I didn't think about importing the silicates from it. I know that it is not the cause of my problem as the tank has never stopped producing diatoms on the glass since day one. I think the snails are keeping it under controll on the rocks.
The growth I have is the brown stuff I asume diatoms, but there is no signs of HA yet. I know I am underpowered with my bulb right now, but before I built the scrubber I would see the HA starting to grow on the glass back there. I of course had to lower the water level back there for the scrubber. I guess patience is in order. I thought it would have HA on it already since it grows so well on my rocks. :lol:
Well for those of you reading....................................HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!
worley
01-01-2009, 11:14 AM
Yes, likewise, happy new year! :D
Patrick Pending
01-06-2009, 03:36 PM
A belated Happy New Year - PP suffered from too much vodka dosing :roll:
Cheers,
Pat. Pending
Alright, here is a winner of a question. How long or how established should I let the scrubber get before I remove my cheato? My scrubber has been cleaned twice now (half at a time) and it is almost completly covered in the brown. There isn't to much real estate left. I would think the cheato is putting the scrubber in competition for the nutrients.
I guess no one has any opinions.
SantaMonica
01-10-2009, 05:00 PM
You can take the chaeto out now. Better than letting it shrivel up slowly.
Thank you,
I have removed it, so lets see if the scrubber grows more rapid. By the way guys I have added more light. It looks like two different spectrums. What i did was add another bulb so that there is two now. One is the 9 watt and the other is 11 watts.
Alright, I just finished building another scrubber for my ten gallon FOWLR. We will see if it works. The plastic canvas floats so I made a center pin to allow it to spin. I have a micro jet pointed at it to make it spin. This way all the screen will recieve the same ammount of light.
The only down side I can see right now is if it doesn't float any more once the alage starts to grow on it. I could always add some ballast if that happens i guess.
SantaMonica
01-17-2009, 02:55 PM
pics?
Okay,
Just a standard 10G with stock lighting.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0117091714.jpg
Bad shot looking through the hood from the top.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0117091714a.jpg
Better shot from underneth. looking through the front glass.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0117091713.jpg
A short video of it spining.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/th_0117091713-1.jpg (http://s385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/?action=view¤t=0117091713-1.flv)
So what do you guys and gals think.?
This is a pretty fresh setup only about three weeks old. Do you think I should rub HA from my other tank to get it going, or should I just let it be.
I should clairify that the tank is three weeks old not the scrubber.
SantaMonica
01-18-2009, 07:26 PM
It should work. Lighting needs to be 10K or under, 6500K would be the best compromise (since it's display lighting too). What is the light power?
Well that is what I am concered about. The factory hood is only 17 watts. Since I built it I removed the chaeto wich was doing okay. Today I have my real first signs of alage on the glass. It looks like diatoms. I am hoping they get started on the screen soon.
SantaMonica
01-19-2009, 04:13 PM
I don't think it will be enough power, or the right K. But do try it.
Do you have any ideas on how I can supplement the lighting in that area? I don't really want to go all out as this is just something to tide me over till the 20 is complete. So I don't want to spend any money on it if I don't have to. But if the idea is doable then......
SantaMonica
01-20-2009, 06:34 PM
Remove the entire hood, and use a clip on light.
Ha, Ha, I knew you would say that. I am scared to go top less as my wifes hair spray goes every where.
Also What does HA look like when it is starting to die? Mine is starting to turn white and shrinking. It is starting to resemble a scrubbie type pad.(only white ish.) If that makes any sense.
SantaMonica
01-28-2009, 09:58 PM
HA on the screen, or in the tank?
SantaMonica
01-29-2009, 04:22 PM
I don't think it's "dying", I think it's being replaces with white coralline (possibly). Dying HA in the display just disappears.
Has anyone changed or switched to using dechlorinated tap water in thier tanks since installing the scrubber?
I would like to switch to tap water so I can cut my water bill. I would think that the scrubber would take up any nitrates or phosphates that might be in my tap water. I have tested it before and there isn't any phosphates and the nitrates are at 10ppm. That is using API test kits. I am sure there is phosphates but API doesn't test below 0.
Does anyone see a problem with this idea?
SantaMonica
02-01-2009, 08:46 PM
None have tried it that I know of. If you must try, do it slowly, and clean the screen more often.
worley
02-02-2009, 12:06 PM
Do you really need to do water changes?
Or are you talking evaporated water top-offs?
I've actually still not done a change in around 5 months now.
Also not used any addatives, and I think I've only just seen the PH dip for the first time at night last night, so I'm doing some tests tonight.
Sorry guys, yes I was in reference to top off water. My little 29 bio cube has now gone topless.(dispite the fear of hair spray) So it has increased my evap by quite a bit. I don't have a ro/di unit so I have been buying distilled water. It's just a pain in the A@# to make sure I have water all the time. As for water changes I just did one two weeks ago I think, and that has been the first change in a couple of months. I have been experimenting pretty heavy with this tank. I am new to the hobbie so I figure running my own tests based upon others advice is the best way to learn. Maybe I am wrong.
On another note I think my scrubber has turned a corner. I wish I had actual numbers for you guys as to the params in my tank but with HA growing in the display and starting the scrubber with chaeto in the tank as well, the test results are so badly scued(spelling) that there is now way my tank was as good as it tested. My tank has never shown nitrates above 10 and the phosphate has never regesterd. I use the API test kits. It is real abvious that I have a problem or I wouldn't be dealing with HA. Anyway I am rambling.........The scrubber has been going since christmas day at about 2:00 PM. I started with a 9 watt CF bulb at 5600K only running when I was able to turn it on and off about 12hrs a day. Now I didn't get the explosion of the brown on my scrubber like most do. Mine just started to grow the red and green right away. I then added a second light bulb for one week to see if it would make any difference. This bulb was a 2700K CF from Ikea. I then got the brown on the scrubber. Not a heavery layer but enough that after reading Santa Monicas post about it I cleaned the whole thing. So I then picked up a timer and a pack of CF 23watt=100watt from Costco. That next week I got an even heaver ammount of the brown on my scrubber so I cleaned the whole thing again. Now we are to this weeks cleaning which was on saterday. I had hardly any brown growth, so I cleaned just the half with a tooth brush and lightly rubbed the other half with my fingers. Today I come home and give a gander and I can see a very faint green haze over the whole thing. I don't have any growth to speak of just the spots that started to grow initally. These spots are slimey feeling but after a scrubbing with a tooth brush they still remain.
After all that what do you guys think? Is it starting to come together?
The timer runs from 7 PM till 11 AM so 16hrs. It comes on 2 hrs before the display lights go off and it goes off 1 hour before the display lights come on. I did this to get the scrubber going, to and get the photo period working for me on the PH.
SantaMonica
02-02-2009, 07:28 PM
Clean your screen twice a week until the brown stuff turns to green, then once a week. After a month, half the HA in your display should be gone. Pics would help.
The brown doesn't seem to be comming back this time.
I would love to post some good pics but I can't right now. All I have is my crappy camera on my phone. I just got done doing about an hour and a half of manual removal of the HA. As anyone knows I didn't really remove it, it just gets mowed down to a height you can't grab it any more.
I will try to borrow some ones camera.
I am wondering if I have enough flow? I have about 250 GPH going over my tile and it is about 7" wide. I have a solid steady stream of water over it but I just don't know. I will post a couple of pics tomorrow when I clean it of the growth. Not much.
Here you go Santa Monica a shot of my display with all the HA in its glory. This is after the manual removal.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0206091839.jpg
Okay a couple more,
In action here,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0206091908.jpg
This is the growth I have so far. Tomorrow is cleaning day.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0206091909.jpg
SantaMonica
02-06-2009, 08:59 PM
How far are the lights from the screen?
I think your flow is fine.
Your P tests read zero, because the HA in the display is eating it.
Remember to not use a toothbrush; leave some algae on on the screen.
My lights are about 4 to 4.5 inches from the screen. The light also has to shine through a pain of glass.
Well I cleaned my scrubber today.
Before,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0206091909.jpg
After,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/0207091514-1.jpg
SantaMonica
02-08-2009, 04:21 AM
Ok, just give it another week. Although yours is the first to use a ceramic tile, I'm sure it will grow.
Well I did some math today at work. My tank even though Oceanic says it is a 29 gallon, it is not. Unless I did the math wrong which is completly possible. I can never rember the number to divide by to get gallons. I used 231. The display side is 15x16x20. So that is about 20 gallons. Now that I am typing this I don't think I am right.
Anyway, I have remeasured my tile and it is 7 3/4" x 9 1/2" so that is 73.5 square inches. My scrubber is a bit big. which is a good thing however I should be letting it go longer between cleanings right? I don't think I did to bad at guessing the size when I started this thread.
So, I am almost double in size. Should I let it go two weeks?
SantaMonica
02-09-2009, 08:15 PM
No it needs to be double in size, just to make up for being one-sided. So it's not oversized at all. One week.
At 20-22 gallons of tank water that is only a need for 40-44 square in. lighted one side. Did I miss something? I thought it was 1 sq.in. per gallon lighted on both sides and 2 sq.in. lighted on one side.
SantaMonica
02-10-2009, 04:30 PM
I see, you are correct.
SantaMonica
02-10-2009, 08:11 PM
You'll need to follow the standard cleaning procedure: Take it to the sink once a week, wash the whole thing in FW, but only clean 1/2 the algae from it. The FW will kill the pods on the other half.
I did a three day lights out period to try and get the scrubber going. All I got was more brown algae. I would suspect this to be because of the HA in the display releasing back to the tank as it had no light. It doesn't look like the black out period did anything for me. So my next question is,
Should I be doing manual removal of the HA in the display?
or should I leave it so the root system will die from lack of light and cause it to release. I know that by removing it, I will be removing nutrients from the tank but....the HA in the display seems to just grow back stronger and faster like the scrubber is supposed to.
Here it is before this weeks cleaning, I also increased the lighting period a couple of hours this last week.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00843.jpg
SantaMonica
02-14-2009, 07:03 PM
You don't need to manually remove anything, or do lights out. After enough algae has grown and been removed from your screen, the display will be clean. Can you post your N and P tests?
Sure I can,
I tested them today just about 6 hours ago. Had to go to dinner with the Wife. :D
N= 0 About as not yellow as you can get as one of the parts is yellow
P= 0 almost clear.
All I have is API test kits. I did have the N tested by a fellow reefer about a month ago and it was tested on a Lamot kit and came in about 2ppm. I don't understand why I can't get the scrubber to get going? :?
Tomorrow I am going to go and get another bulb for my light fixture. Since I went top less just a little while ago I have switched the lighting out on the display. It is to yellow for me. So I am changing it up. It has a 50/50 6500K and a 10,000K along with a 50/50 460 actinic and a 430? actinic. I will be switching the daylight with a 50/50 10,000K and a 460 actinic. Maybe that will help to discourage the growth in the display a little bit.
Well I thought I would post this pic just for fun. These guys are the extra push I had when I decided to go ahead and built my scrubber.
Today was feeding day.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00844.jpg
kcress
02-15-2009, 04:59 PM
Crazy shrimp!
Ok, here is this weeks cleaning,
Before cleaning,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00877.jpg
After cleaning,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00879.jpg
What was colected from the scrubber, This was mushy like in texture.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00882.jpg
SantaMonica
02-22-2009, 11:14 AM
Looks good. Keep it up weekly.
Thanks SM,
Do you think I would benefit from adding the screen material? I have a ton of that stuff here at the house. I am just not sure how I would attach it to the tile?
I chose that piece of tile cause of the ribs it has on it. Al-tho I was hopping to use it in the other direction so the water would ripple over them. If you look at the after pic you can see them. I was also surprised at how much was left after the scrapping on top of the ribs.
Crazy shrimp!
Thanks, they are a kick in the pants to watch them drag a starfish back to their little spot, in the back of the tank. It is impressive to see them attack it, overpower it, flip it over, and carry-drag it over the top of rocks and what not. They are messy tho, they leave little pieces of the star behind.
Thanks SM,
Do you think I would benefit from adding the screen material? I have a ton of that stuff here at the house. I am just not sure how I would attach it to the tile?
I chose that piece of tile cause of the ribs it has on it. Al-tho I was hopping to use it in the other direction so the water would ripple over them. If you look at the after pic you can see them. I was also surprised at how much was left after the scrapping on top of the ribs.
I am just bumping this I don't want it to go unseen. Since we are on a new page.
SantaMonica
02-22-2009, 01:06 PM
Well keep it as it is, and see how much stays after cleaning.
kcress
02-22-2009, 01:46 PM
What's wrong with your tile?? Looks good to me. Sideways ripples can cause more splashing since they can 'jump' the water off the surface.
OK, I will let it be.
I guess this way, we will see how well a piece of tile works out for others.
Thank you guys for the responses.
By the way, did you folks notice my coraline growing on the top of my tile?
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00877-1.jpg
Okay,
Now I was forced to move my tank this week.
At the beginning of this week we noticed that the dishwasher was leaking. Now when it became noticable that it was leaking, wow what a mess. It has been leaking for some time now unannounced to us. So after the insurance company got back to us and instructed as to what they wanted done, the end of the week was just about here. My wife had to do some fast foot work to get a crew in here and get things ripped up. So when I got home Friday I was told that the tanks had to be moved cause they were coming back Saturday morning. Now I have been on OT so I have been getting up at 2:30AM to go and work an 11HR day. I also had to be to work on Saturday. So after giving it my all, I was able to turn the pumps on at Midnight. Anyway......Here is this weeks cleaning.
And of course the rocks don't ever go in the way you had them, so I changed the aqua scape. I am not so sure I like it. :x
Before,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00887-1.jpg
After,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00888-1.jpg
SantaMonica
03-01-2009, 07:39 PM
Good work for such a hard day :)
worley
03-02-2009, 05:49 AM
Lol tell me about it, the day the new tank (6x2x2) was due to be delivered (to a flat, up a flight of stairs, through doorways that are only 25" wide!!), our toilet blocked. Being in a flat in a 500 year old building, we don't have standard waste pipework, it all goes through 3/4" overflow pipe through a macerator that chops/pumps all the nasty stuff out...
From experience in the past, none of the plumbers wanted to deal with it, being something they don't really know much about, so we ended up taking it all apart and cleaning it (yuck) then having to hook up a hosepipe to the wastepipe and putting full water pressure on it to unblock it all (made a big bang noise when it unblocked, nearly thought the pipes exploded! lol), that took virtually the whole day, at the same time the server running one of the big sites at work (and this one) died and had to spend 5 hours fixing it, all on my day off work... then the tank turned up!
As you can imagine, pretty knackering day lol, and the day before we had moved the old 3x2x2 tank (and fish and corals and liverock) and had to replumb the algae scrubber to extend the 6mm tubing to reach the old tanks temporary resting place.
Everything seems to go wrong when you need to do something important!
WOW...... well worley,
I think about all I can say is, I would much rather deal with dirty dish water. I get close enough to what you went through when I have to dig up the septic for a pump out. That is to close for me. :mrgreen:
It was cleaning day again. I have had a pretty big growth spurt of the HA in the display since I had to move the tank. But it looks like it is already starting to suffer badly again. I am not seeing the brown tips at the moment, however I am seeing big white centers and bubbles forming in those areas. So here are the cleaning pics.
Before, I think I got some real good growth this time around. It has grown bigger clumps and more of them.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00893.jpg
After cleaning,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00895.jpg
This one shows the holes the pods like to eat in your scrubber. The whole scrubber was moving when you looked at it cause of all the teanie tiny pods.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00894.jpg
By the way, this is the only sink I have to do anything in since the water damage in the kitchen. This past week has been a dry, loud, and busy one that's for sure. My floor has been cut out like a jig saw puzzle, and the cabinets have been torn out. The living room was also wet from this as it abuts the wall the dish washer was on. So the floor in there is half gone. It was a good thing I had PERGO flooring, as we put down the better under padding that had a vapor barrier on one side. So just the laminate flooring was damaged in there. Well thank goodness we have insurance and pay the bill cause they are replacing it all. All new cabnets, and floors in both rooms.
So if pods are sorta a bad thing for the scrubbers, can I do a simple FW rinse without scrapping the screen in between cleanings?
worley
03-12-2009, 11:57 AM
Doing a FW rinse after cleaning should be enough as they won't get over 7 days old, unless you really have tonnes of them then it may be worth doing between cleans
SantaMonica
03-12-2009, 04:56 PM
Certainly. You can even pour your top-off over it. Even kalkwasser has ben tried, and it did not hurt it.
Wouldn't it be bad to kill the pods wile still in the system? One, it would be decaying matter but, also the nutrient laden algae they have consumed would also be released back into the water column. Right?
I think I will remove it to do a fresh water rinse in between cleanings. You can see the pod damage this week.
Here is this weeks cleaning,
Before,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00899-1.jpg
After,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00900-1.jpg
Oh yea I almost forgot about this.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00900-1-1.jpg
kcress
03-15-2009, 02:22 PM
The hard to get off stuff you highlight is, The Stuff. You didn't seed it and there you are!
SantaMonica
03-15-2009, 02:45 PM
Good point about in-system pod-killing. I guess if a long-term scrubber were ever to be designed, it would appear to need (in addition to a very large size and lighting) a switching drain, so that FW could automatically be applied as the scrubber drained into a waste. When done with the FW it would switch back to draining into the system.
Aquagold
03-16-2009, 03:24 PM
Could the freshwater rinse be used as a top up each day?
That would then facilitate a longer more proactive approach to 'maintenance'.... ie pods would not get sufficent in numbers to create problem areas and freshwater would be used efficently rather than to waste.... just some thoughts as I hate seeing water being 'dumped'.
Just some thoughts and maybe something for a new thread so that the discussion doesn't hijack this thread.
Rob @Aquagold
SantaMonica
03-16-2009, 04:55 PM
Yes it could... has been talked about before, but not tried. But at was mentioned above, the dead pods still get washed into the system. This might be good for corals and small fish, but from a purely nutrient-reducing viewpoint, it's working against you. That's why I mentioned the "switching drain" option.
worley
03-16-2009, 07:06 PM
I would have thought, if done daily, the amount of pods building up should be minimal as would their overall biomass, however doing it weekly would cause more problems.
kcress
03-16-2009, 10:59 PM
I don''t think the pod die off would come anywhere close to the nitrate reducing destruction they create. The top-off across the screen is an EXCELLENT idea!
Wow, we got a little action going on here.
Die off is die off right? I mean I get that the pods wont be very large, there by not being as great of a threat. However, lots of a little, creates something. My other concern on the topping off over the scrubber is, We are only using flow in one direction. Thereby creating low flow areas around the filaments of the algae itself. That is why the surge style and the dump style are more effective. So by pouring the water over the scrubber I don't think we would come close to getting the pods wet with the fresh water. I mean, they are at the base of the algae eating the "roots" if you will.
On a side note, has anyone experienced algae in the DT out doing the scrubber? I had HA to begin with, then I built the scrubber, I then went through a large growth of HA which I attributed to the leaching of the rock. Then it started to turn brown and white and disappear. I have now seemed to have regressed, to an even bigger algae growth in the DT. It started coming on last week and now.......WOW, I have almost the whole tank covered in HA. Since this last growth spurt it seems to have depleted its source a bit, cause I now have some of it turning white at the base. But I have a huge amount of dark green and lush HA. It is like I am displaying HA. :lol:
Sorry no pics tonight, but I will post tomorrow when I get home from work. Stay tuned.
kcress
03-17-2009, 10:00 PM
Hmmm Most fun! Part of why aquariums are so interesting.
What do you feed your tank denizens?
SantaMonica
03-17-2009, 11:37 PM
Zoa I am not surprised, since you have had almost no growth on your scrubber. You should be pulling off a half pound of wet algae every week from your screen by now. If you like, we can diagnose it.
I would love some help. Well as promised.
The embarrassing picture of my tank.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00901.jpg
SantaMonica
03-18-2009, 10:47 PM
Ah, well that's part of the problem. Thick HA in the tank is consuming a lot of the nutrients that your scrubber should be getting. In order to out-compete established HA, your scrubber has to be VERY powerful... lighting power, lighting distance, strong flow, rough screen surface. I'm going to bet that it's your lighting. However..
Post several pics of your sump, scrubber, scrubber lights, and the flow off the bottom of the screen. And gather up this info if you would:
Nitrate
Phosphate
Size of screen.
Gallons in display.
Type of bulb for scrubber: Watts, Kelvin, and age.
Screen is lit on one or both sides?
Distance of bulb from screen.
How many hours the scrubber lights are on.
Amount, and what, fed per day.
Mechanical filters, including skimmer.
Circulation GPH in-tank.
Circulation GPH to the sump and back.
I will post that info for you as soon as I get a chance too. I will test the water so I can give you the most recent tests.
Now I have done manual removal of the HA in the past. I wait till it gets about this long and then I pull, pull, pull, it out.
Also, I have asked you this earlier in my thread, you stated that I didn't need to do any manual removal or lights out periods.
I can tell you I don't have a ton of flow in the tank. It is a 29G Bio Cube and I have modded it out to allow the scrubber. The scrubber is lit on one side. It is 7 3/4"x9 1/2". I have a 23 watt CFL that is 2700K and it is three inches away from the scrubber. It is on 18 hours a day on a reverse cycle from my tank. I have 400 GPH going over my scrubber. I have another 240GPH pump in the tank for flow and that is it. There is no skimmer. I use carbon. I feed frozen mysis and krill. I use a little less than half a cube a day. I do not feed both I only feed one type at a time. I rotate from one day to the next.
Ok,
Nitrate=0
Phosphate=0
With that much algae in there, I am not sure what the true readings are. I have also just completed manual removal.
SantaMonica
03-19-2009, 06:34 PM
Any foam, floss, or bio media?
Can you post of pics of the screen in operation?
No foam, No floss, No bio media.
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00902.jpg
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00903.jpg
kcress
03-20-2009, 02:57 AM
Your hair ain't nothing like the amount I have! One of my tanks is like a dark morass.
That could be part of my problem too. Except my nitrates are still +1000ppm. :shock: So the scrubber should have something to feed on.
SantaMonica
03-20-2009, 03:37 PM
Ok, I see two problems...
1. Replace the bulb, preferably with more wattage (at least for now, while fighting the nuisance algae). CFLs only last 3 months as it is, but yours may be weak for some other reason. There is more HA up by the light, and that tells you that the light is weak.
2. Go ahead and lay some plastic canvas over the tile. Whenever you have islands of HA, like on yours, it means the algae is only able to grab on to those spots. So rough-sand some plastic canvas real good (both sides), and lay it on there. The brown algae has even coverage because it does not grow into long strands. But HA grows into long strands, which catches the water and gets washed away. So it just needs more places to attach.
After a week, you should have even HA coverage left to right, top to bottom. And a week or so after that, your nuisance algae should start reducing.
OK,
Sorry I haven't got back sooner. So I have done the weekly cleaning on the appropriate day (Saturday) Then on Sunday I added the a screen. However the screen would not lay flat no matter what I did. So Yesterday I decided to drill my tile and secure the screen down so I could get even flow across it. It drilled fine but putting in one of my plastic plugs I managed to push to hard and I broke my tile. :x I normally would not care as I have another one but, this one has turf growing on it. So I drilled it more and rigged it together with zip ties. I figure after the screen has good growth on it (My turf) I can install the new tile. Heck if this stays together I may never mess with it. As long as it grows algae.
So I changed the bulb out for a new one. It is not any more wattage. I have not gotten that far. I have added some screen to the scrubber. After just a couple of days of not being flat I still had quite a bit of growth, and it was long and stringy. I haven't gotten that kind of growth before. It has just been a green short algae.
So the pics.
Before cleaning,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00905-1.jpg
After cleaning,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00906-1.jpg
Now with a screen on top of my broken tile, :x
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00910-1.jpg
And here it is installed. I think I have good flow??
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00911.jpg
SantaMonica
03-25-2009, 06:55 PM
Actually the flow looks low; the main effect of low flow will be when growth gets thick: the algae will grow up and out of the water, and thus stop growing. This will limit your filtering. But you can deal with that later. I think the screen is going to help big time for now, as will the new light. But do start looking for long-term fixes: Larger area; more flow; more bulb wattage, or an extra bulb.
Did you sand the screen? If not, do it now.
worley
03-26-2009, 03:35 AM
I think it will certainly grow better than the tile did, and there's enough room for a reasonable amount to stay after cleaning to help fast regrowth, shame about the broken tile!
You'll probably find the algae grows up through the screen pretty fast (much faster than starting a new screen) as you've got it in contact with the tile, as SantaMonica says, make sure you've sanded the plastic screen (best to rinse it down with fresh water after so the sand particles don't fall into the tank as they sometimes contain metals and other nasties).
Thanks for the responses. This is suppose to be temporary. I am in the middle of a 20L build with a 20L sump. I know I am going backwards in gallon-age but, this tank should look good. I am done with all the glass work, I just need to make up my mind on the background and built the stand. I do plan on a bigger scrubber for it. Since the kitchen has gone to h@%% it has been put on hold.
Yes I did rough it up. I used a file. A really rough file. It is like a rasp. Also I did rinse it off before I placed in the tank.
I guess we will have to wait and see on the flow.
Tomorrow is cleaning day. I plan on rinsing it off. I can't imagine there to be to much growth.
Can I expect to see the turf grow up through the plastic? Or am I out of luck on that. It is actually the reason I want to rinse it off tomorrow. I don't want it to get blocked by the brown algae.
SantaMonica
03-27-2009, 06:24 PM
It will grow up through the screen. I just had a friend do the same thing, and it completely covered the canvas. He then removed the underlying sheet.
I am thinking of adding a lawn mower blenny. To help out with the HA in the display. What do you think?
SantaMonica
03-28-2009, 12:37 PM
Sure why not, will only help. After the HA is gone, you can donate him back to the store.
Well as I would suspect, there was not much growth on the scrubber yester day. It was only three days of growth.
I picked up a blenny, so I hope that will help me out.
before cleaning,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00912-1.jpg
After,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/DSC00913-1.jpg
Well, the lighting must be the cause of my failure. I have gotten more growth however it is not green. My algae has always been clear to clear yellow. I don't run my lights 24/7, I run the max of 18 hours. I am going to cut that down to 16 hours.
So, can anyone tell me what ballasts to buy from the depot or lowes to run PC bulbs. I am thinking of making another scrubber that mounts to the wall above my tank. If I use a PC or even a standard fluorescent bulb I can make it a little more sleek.
Pics of the scrubber cleaning will come in a day or two.
worley
04-05-2009, 06:21 PM
That's good, the green hair etc will come eventually, it cycles just like a tank does with algae cycles =). Try and clean the screen if it is completely covered in the brown/yellow algae to such an extent it's smothering any other algaes, that should give a chance for the hair to grow (you can do it more often than once a week, but I'd say no more than every 3 days)
More light is better, would be interesting to see the difference between 18 hours and 16 hours of light a day.
Here are the pics.
Before,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/P4070006-1.jpg
After,
http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/pentair/P4070008-1-1.jpg
SantaMonica
04-07-2009, 05:08 PM
It's white because ther is not enough flow. Or sometimes, because the light is on 24 hours.
What if I flood the back chamber so the scrubber is under water? The display is growing HA like mad and it is attached to rocks.
I have 400 GPH going over the scrubber and it is 8" across. I don't understand how I don't have enough flow. Let me crunch some math. :?
SantaMonica
04-08-2009, 10:22 PM
You can move the light farther away (best), or reduce the number of "on" hours.
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