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Thread: Keeping up Ca, Mg and str.

  1. #121
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    Another think to think about... since mixing vinegar adds carbon, it might reduce the growth of a scrubber, the way dosing vodka/pellets does.

  2. #122
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    I think that is a possibility, especially as you add a higher ratio of vinegar to the Kalk powder. I would have to review the articles again to look at the chemical equations in my copious free time. IIRC the purpose of adding the vinegar is to cause the calcium content of the Kalk to increase enough to offset the need for additional calcium dosing. I do remember there was comment that there was the additional benefit of adding carbon for denitrifying bacteria, but if the 'perfect amount' of vinegar was used then I would think most of this would go towards upping the calcium and not increasing the carbon input. I could be completely wrong though because I didn't consider that part of it too heavily when considering this. So if anyone has insight that would be good...

  3. #123
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    So, after 5 days of dripping the 30% Kalk solution and testing 4 days, generally at the same time each day (around Noon), the Alk is maintaining at almost exactly 6.7 dKH (Salifert new kit) and Cal is maintaining between 415-425 (also Salifert), and pH on the days I've tested it has been 7.99 +/- 0.03. Cal has come up ever so slightly, maybe 5ppm/day. That's OK though because the 7" clam goes in this weekend.

    At this point, I'm thinking that going to a 40% solution would be fine, and I'll continue to monitor levels without doing a correction quite yet. I see no need to freak out when everything looks OK - except the frogspawns, plate, and dendro, none of which have been doing well since putting them in the tank, so I'm taking them out and putting them back in my tank.

    Only downer is that I lost a fish, one of the B&W clowns committed suicide sometime between Friday afternoon and Saturday afternoon (kalk dosing hadn't started until after he disappeared). I found him today between the stand and the wall.



    RIP little dude.

  4. #124
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    My false did that a couple months ago.
    150G. Reef/Mix
    125G. 3 Regular Oscars/1 Jack Dempsey
    75G. 20+ Africans
    40G. Fish/Reef. Algae Scrubbers on ALL my SW
    10G. SW Fish/Reef.
    10G. SW Hospital/new fish quarantine/pod breeder tank
    6 stage RO/DI system 200 GPD.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Floyd R Turbo View Post
    I do remember there was comment that there was the additional benefit of adding carbon for denitrifying bacteria, but if the 'perfect amount' of vinegar was used then I would think most of this would go towards upping the calcium and not increasing the carbon input.
    I don't think that is exactly correct Floyd. I believe there is a secondary carbon source within vinegar that isn't used by Kalk. Only the CO2 part is used. I believe Randy stated it was something crazy like 45ml per gallon is the max vinegar to kalk ratio to be able to use up all the CO2. From the quote early on in this thread:

    after all the cool Calcium ion chemistry is over, the leftover Acetate ions from the broken-down Vinegar leaves you with free organic Carbon in the water that feeds the bacteria in your tank so that it converts more poisonous Nitrates to NO2 gas (a very good thing)
    Sorry to hear about your clown.. what is it with clowns in the last year. Been in this hobby over 20 years, never seen or heard of a clown jumping out of a tank, in the last year I must have seen it happen at least a dozen times. Weird and sad.

  6. #126
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    I blame it on the solar cycle.

  7. #127
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    I just mixed up a 40% batch, put 4 tsp in a 1 qt container and poured in 80 mL vinegar, shook it up good until it started to cool a bit, then put about a cup or RODI in it then poured into a 5g bucket of RODI. There does not appear to be any precipitate and I can see the bottom easily right away! That is definitely the way to go.

  8. #128
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    I re-did my batch to 50% ro/di then added the rest of the ro/di and it was clear right away and barley no precipitate but, I did use 2 rounded teaspoons per gallon so that would account for the little I had.
    150G. Reef/Mix
    125G. 3 Regular Oscars/1 Jack Dempsey
    75G. 20+ Africans
    40G. Fish/Reef. Algae Scrubbers on ALL my SW
    10G. SW Fish/Reef.
    10G. SW Hospital/new fish quarantine/pod breeder tank
    6 stage RO/DI system 200 GPD.

  9. #129
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    Well, at least 2 weeks of dosing and for the last week I've bumped it up to 50% solution, mixing 5 tsp with 100 mL vinegar then pouring that into a 5g bucket of RO/DI. I have been trying to let it settl the best I can, but it's not ideal since I mix the bucket then put it in my car and drive there, so whatever sediment there is (very little) mixes up into the solution and has to settle out again. But regardless, I have a pre-filter before the aqualifter and that actually tends to collect a bit of sediment and I've cleaned it out once in 2 weeks. Been going through about 1.3 gallons/day roughly.

    Alk is still holding steady around 6.7 to 7.0 but no higher and bumping the concentration up has done nothing.

    Calcium is holding relatively stable, if not dropping slightly. Still never below 415 and not above 425.

    The pH has of late started to drop to right around 7.8.

    At this point, after 2 weeks of using this, I can say that I like it. So much so that I may build an ATO box instead of doing replacing buckets, so I can get a little more capacity. Also this will take more of the burden off the owner. Right now I do the top off because I'm wanting to get the method down, so I'm in there every other day checking and refilling. Eventually I will just mix up a large batch in a trash can and the pull out the clear mixture. Probably will provide him a pump also, that way he doesn't have to worry about scooping water out of one bucket and into the next, or switching buckets.

    I think the next step will be to adjust the Alk upwards with BRS Alk to get it to 9.0 and Cal to 425 and then watch it for a couple weeks to see if the 50% strength will maintain it. I see no reason why not except that a heightened concentration may mean an increase in uptake or some screwed up logic like that...

  10. #130
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    I have been a little more aggressive as I am only diluted by about 25%. My goal is to maintain about 10 Alk and about 450 Ca. I need to be more consistent with my dosing. I ran out twice and did a couple days the last couple weeks with straight ro/di. I seem to be very close to my goal but the Alk is in the low to mid 9's but my Ca is 400 425 so if I dont run out I should be hitting my marks. I hope!!
    150G. Reef/Mix
    125G. 3 Regular Oscars/1 Jack Dempsey
    75G. 20+ Africans
    40G. Fish/Reef. Algae Scrubbers on ALL my SW
    10G. SW Fish/Reef.
    10G. SW Hospital/new fish quarantine/pod breeder tank
    6 stage RO/DI system 200 GPD.

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