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Thread: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

  1. #21
    kcress's Avatar
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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    It's my understanding that people use sodium HID lights for their algae based sumps because it works. You'd probably need to confirm that though.


    Another thing you will need: A TS that big would be a huge pain to clean manually. You might consider something like a leather splitter design. A couple of rollers with the screen running around them in a large conveyor belt like setup. Put a sharp blade over one roller on the vertical face. As you turn the rollers and the belt passes under the blade you hair cut the turf and the cut-off falls off the vertical face into a hopper ready for disposal. You could even set it up so the belt is in continuous motion. Running it's full length every few days or a week. This would allow a very small motor to provide continual harvest.

  2. #22

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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    Odd you should say that kcress, I was thinking along the same lines as manually cleaning screens of that size would be a big job!
    Of course, you can also use all the algae that has been removed for composting, it'd make great fertilizer.

  3. #23

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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    good idea

  4. #24

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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    That's crazy cool would love to have that system for propagating very high end coral's lol
    I'll get my goggle's

  5. #25

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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    Quote Originally Posted by worley
    Odd you should say that kcress, I was thinking along the same lines as manually cleaning screens of that size would be a big job!
    Of course, you can also use all the algae that has been removed for composting, it'd make great fertilizer.
    or fuel I think lol

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_CRQYw9 ... re=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MeIgaRf ... xt_from=PL

    closed loop bioreactor
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyoKTbxe ... re=related

    Algae the fastest growing plant

  6. #26

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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    Most aquaculture ventures face two major water problems; suspended solids and dissolved organic matter. Both use valuable oxygen.
    You will need to trap and remove the suspended solids so that you can then use the ATS screens for removing the dissolved organics.
    The fish you want to grow needs to be if possible a vegetarian fish species so that you can use your Algae from the screens to feed the fish.
    If that is not the case then you might want to try some snails, slugs or like animals which will keep your screens cleaned instead of you having to clean them.
    Heavy protein fed fish produce large amounts of feacal matter that is rich in proteins that affect oxygen in tanks so they require big filtration.
    Supplimental aireation over the night periods will be sufficent to get most stocking densities through the dark periods.
    Keep an eye on your alkalinity levels as this will affect your water chemistry more than just CO2.

    I suggest that what ever system you end up using - stock your ponds low in fish numbers so that you don't have as many problems,

    High stocking density has many pitfalls that require a lot of knowledge that you will want to learn slowly as you go.

    I would suggest you go and see other fish farms in your area and discuss your situation with other fish farmers as they will be your best friends in the years to come. Mainly because you will share many trials and errors.
    A problem shared is a problem halved. Other fish farmers will also benefit from your algae trials.

    We all here will help you further on any algae filter plans yu have but I say as a fish farmer to another seek a local fish farmer you can talk to and share your thoughts with him on the fish farming area.

    Otherwise we could double the size of the content of this forum just talking about the dynamics of farming fish.

    Use gravity to feed the algae beds after the fish tanks and put some sort of mechanical filtration between the fish and the algae or have it flow past the algae screens.

    Are you reusing the water or doing a flow through system from the well?

    Reuse of the water will require you to use some sort of solids filter, even if you consider some sort of plants. Plants require oxygen around their 'root' structure.

  7. #27
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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    Good points, but there is a fly in the ointment...

    You will need to trap and remove the suspended solids so that you can then use the ATS screens for removing the dissolved organics.
    Scrubbers don't remove organics, just Inorganics.

    If that is not the case then you might want to try some snails, slugs or like animals which will keep your screens cleaned instead of you having to clean them.
    Having animals eat the screens will only put the material back into the water, which then won't solve your lack-of-oxygen problem. Best to isolate the screen so no animals get on it.

  8. #28

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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    Most ventures of this sort are trying a poly culture technique so that the algal screens can become a food source for something else.
    Aireation is usually done through venturi injection and pure oxygen.
    The nutrient loading in aquaculture is much higher than any home system and the whole thing is balanced between too much feed and not enough.

    I agree in part to what you are saying SantaMonica, I would use a quote here but I;m still figuring out forums. but there are more elements to this equation that just how scrubbers work.

    As for the inorganic and organic terminology, would I be correct in saying the surface area of the combined scrubbers pipes, sides of ponds, etc convert organic into inorganic? If this is the case then the scrubber will uptake the converted organics.

    Next we look at putting snails for example on the screens to feed. They are doing the same conitual process we do once a week with a cleaning.
    I know this is the case as it was what we did on the abalone farm. We ended up with nearly 300m2 worth of screen growing 400=800,000 ab's and still we ran out of feed. To get abalone to settle on your algal plates you have to manually scrub the plates semi clean to 'mow' the algae down so that the algae had a nice pasture to graze on.
    Instead of manually scrubbing we ended up using bigger abs to 'mow' our algae plates.
    Before the new abs went in we harvested the older abs and seeded the fresh plates with the swimming larvae.

    All this cut down on manual labour which costs money.

    Aquaculture is where science and economics meet in a tug of war arena, with the farmer trying to keep some sort of balance and make a profit.

    Only coral reefs seem to have this finer tipping point and require absolute 'perfect water'.

    Hoping that I'm not just trying to justify my own remarks but are backed up by what I've seen on the farm I managed and my own place.

  9. #29
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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    Ok as long as you remove the snails, that's sort of the same as removing algae; the nutrients are coming out.

    However, for the organics, I think what you are referring to is the bacteria that eats rotting food; they turn the food into ammonia and CO2, which is why you don't want any food laying around; you want all food to be eaten by corals or fish. And the organics you are referring to, those microscopic food particles that are dissolved in the water, go through the same process of being eaten by these bacteria; however this type of bacteria is everywhere in the system, not just on surfaces. The "surface" type of bacteria (which lives on the surface of glass, plastic, rocks, sand, etc) is the "nitrifying" type, which does not eat Organics (food). Instead they eat Inorganics (Ammonia/Ammonium and Nitrite, the ones we are concerned with) and convert them to Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate. Then of course, in the DSB's or live rock are yet a third type of bacteria which eat the Inorganic Nitrate, converting it to Nitrogen gas. What remains, however, is Inorganic Phosphate, and this is what causes nuisance algae problems.

    So, algae (whether nuisance, or scrubber) eat mostly Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate. Not Organics. Thus, having a scrubber does not contribute to removing Organics. Scrubbers just remove the results of rotting Organics (Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate).

  10. #30

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    Re: 10.000 m3 (2.641.720 Gallons ) Tank Project

    Will leave it there and see how natapa is going finding more out about his fish farming journey

    Are you plans changing at all natapa on how you think you might build this operation?
    Did you get a chance to talk with any fish farmers in your area?

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