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Thread: ATS

  1. #1

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    ATS

    decided on this

    above sump
    lighting:4-t5 total h.o 3"to 3 1/2" from screen
    2-t5 on each side
    acrylic box:16"H x 26"Lx6"W
    screen:22 1/2"W x 13 1/2"H
    flow: 750G pump
    maybe a surge device set on 3 minute on/off interval's

    was hopping it would compliment my new system in the work's:

    200g system

    approx 160 lb's L.R mostly man made and seeded with irratant free L.R

    Display:

    90G-48"Lx18"Wx24"H 3"dsb

    Lighting:

    Tek lighting canopy with individual reflector's

    4-20 000k / 2-figi / 2-12 000k shaded with tin foil on edges moon light with cycle's

    Flow: like wheat in a gentle breeze no thrashing current's

    40G kenya tree nutrient scrubber raceway:

    above sump

    lighting:4-t5's 2-10 000k 2-20 000k

    acrylic race way:36"Lx24"Wx12"H 60 plug's 6"-8" tall tree's

    216" of water channel track 2"-3" dsb

    Flow:400 to 500gph

    20G shrimp only tank:

    above display

    lighting:2-normal output 65 00k/20 000k

    plumbed 8 to 10 shrimp's 3" dsb

    50G refuge:

    above display

    lighting:4-normal output 3-6 500 k 1-20 000K

    48"Lx12"Wx18"H

    3"dsb

    Culture's:

    phyto culture forsure,amphipod culture forsure, still looking into other culture of pod's that will reproduce in the aquarium
    along with being fairly easy to culture on the side

    coral's:

    zoo,paly,yuma,gorgonian,Christmas Tree Coral,sunpolyp,dandro,duncan,Scleronephthya-Cauliflower Coral-Orange, Red, Violet ,pink,yellow etc

    Fish:

    renting a pair of nemo's and 3-chromis's for the first bit of preperation's and a small female mandarin that will stay later I'll get rid of chromis's/nemo's later and keep the female mandarin then I'll slowly add the 2nd male mandarin and hopefuly/maybe some day a pair of pipefish's only if they will be ok food wise who know's what after that nothing aggressive or will compete for food with the pipefish/mandarin's afterward's I think lol

    10G top off reservoir,kalk,phyto drip,pod culture dosing,10% weekly water changes,quarinteen tank,20g frag,extreme irratant removel and prevention

  2. #2

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    Re: ATS

    Got the ATS idea from santa monica

    that was just when I bought a mrc it's for sale now and unattached

    alway's missed my first 7 tank's that had no skimmer's or one's that didn't work I alway's relied on heavy phyto/little frozen food feeding'/medium to small fish load to keep population up,rock's,flow,3"dsb,worm's,zooplankton scavenger's,sponge,mini serpent star etc to keep a clean tank along with regular 10% water changes

  3. #3
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    Re: ATS

    Congrats on the new design! Forward thinking. Here's some tips...

    22 wide X 12 high is a giant screen for a regular 200g system (although yours is really only a 90g.) 2 t5's on each side will not be enough to make use of all that screen area. For high-power scrubbing, you want a t5 every 3" at the most (I have two bulbs for a 5" screen). You could either add one or two bulbs per side (for high power scrubbing), or move the bulbs to the middle of the screen, which would reduce algae growth near the pipe, and also keep the bulbs farther from the water for safety.

    No surge is needed to work effectively. I have not seen any difference in nutrient removal with or without a surge. And it's so much easier to not have one.

    Since you are going to have nps, you might go the extra-high-power scrubber route:

    Adding bulbs (2700k)
    Using two screens (clean one at a time)
    Pancaking screens (allows algae to grip)
    Use rug-canvas (and replace as needed)

    Regular-power scrubbing needs 0.5W CFL per gal; High-power scrubbing (like mine) needs 1 W per gal. If you consider your system to be 200g, you'll want 100W on each side of the screen. Since your 24" T5 bulbs will be 24W each, you'll want 4 on each side. And this is especially needed since you will be feeding ultra heavy for the NPS. Matter of fact, I might go so far as to say that NPS tanks need the most scrubbing of any type of tank (including large predetor tanks, which are skimmed.) So your large screen is really not that large for an NPS tank, but you do have to have the light-power to make use of the screen area.

  4. #4

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    Re: ATS

    what if I went 60 plus kenya trees 6" tall in a nutrient scrubber 216" of water channel would this offset by chance the undersize ATS?

  5. #5
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    Re: ATS

    Kenya trees, or any other coral, are not as powerful as a scrubber (because the scrubber put s the algae so near to the light.) In general, softies don't thrive in a scrubbed tank because of this. So if the purpose of having softies is just to have nice looking corals for decoration, you can fix the situation by feeding MUCH MUCH more (like five times more) than you did before the scrubber. But if the purpose of the softies is to "remove nutrients" (and thus you do NOT feed more), then they are going to lose against the scrubber. I.e, the better the scrubber operates, the smaller the softies will shrink.

    Thus, in your case ("removing nutrients"), I would not do the Kenya scrubber at all. I'd stick with your size screen, and I'd make it high power by using 4 bulbs per side, two layers of rug-canvas, and two separate screens fed by two separate flows which can be shut off independently. You are going to need to feed tremendous amount of phyto, roti's, etc, in order to even have a chance at keeping the gorgs, suns, sclero's, etc.

  6. #6

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    Re: ATS

    Is having a undersized ATS like the one I already bought the light's/pump for will this benefit me If I wanted to keep in a little inorganic's to possibly keep a little algae growing in the system so I can scrap the glass and feed some of my zooplankton maybe some small fish just wanted to have a little control of inorganic's I've run tank's before without a ATS or protein skimmer or refuge usually 20G and heavy dosing of phyto with no problem's always relied on large population's of scavenger's,soft coral etc as filter's?

    was hoping the ats I was planning on building will do a ok job nothing heavy duty just enough to keep nitrate/phosphate just under 10 ppm just as a compliment along with rufuge/nutrent scrubber

    while the softy/kenya tree nutrient scrubber will be mainly as a propagating area that can be scaled back along with feeding depending on inorganic testing

  7. #7

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    Re: ATS

    Quote Originally Posted by SantaMonica
    Congrats on the new design! Forward thinking. Here's some tips...

    22 wide X 12 high is a giant screen for a regular 200g system (although yours is really only a 90g.) 2 t5's on each side will not be enough to make use of all that screen area. For high-power scrubbing, you want a t5 every 3" at the most (I have two bulbs for a 5" screen). You could either add one or two bulbs per side (for high power scrubbing), or move the bulbs to the middle of the screen, which would reduce algae growth near the pipe, and also keep the bulbs farther from the water for safety.

    No surge is needed to work effectively. I have not seen any difference in nutrient removal with or without a surge. And it's so much easier to not have one.

    Since you are going to have nps, you might go the extra-high-power scrubber route:

    Adding bulbs (2700k)
    Using two screens (clean one at a time)
    Pancaking screens (allows algae to grip)
    Use rug-canvas (and replace as needed)

    Regular-power scrubbing needs 0.5W CFL per gal; High-power scrubbing (like mine) needs 1 W per gal. If you consider your system to be 200g, you'll want 100W on each side of the screen. Since your 24" T5 bulbs will be 24W each, you'll want 4 on each side. And this is especially needed since you will be feeding ultra heavy for the NPS. Matter of fact, I might go so far as to say that NPS tanks need the most scrubbing of any type of tank (including large predetor tanks, which are skimmed.) So your large screen is really not that large for an NPS tank, but you do have to have the light-power to make use of the screen area.
    I'm open to the height of the scrubber screen being lower just not sure about the box demension's etc with a 750G pump what demension's of the box should I use? what size bulkhead's? 2 or 1

    will the scrubber I plan equal that of a 5G pail with 4 -23 watt light's?

    if so then it will do only because I want some growth of algae in the tank

  8. #8

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    Re: ATS

    No surge is needed to work effectively. I have not seen any difference in nutrient removal with or without a surge. And it's so much easier to not have one.

    that's cool didn't really want to use it


    I can alway's add another Ats later if my inorganic's get too high

    any advantages to having the screen I'm using and glueing together a second one to the other side making the squares line up or should I alternate the square's so they are cut in half?

  9. #9
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    Re: ATS

    Is having a undersized ATS like the one I already bought
    It's not undersize if you don't have the kenya's, and if you use 4 bulbs per side.

    I wanted to keep in a little inorganic's
    You always have inorganics; they are just too low for the test kits to measure.

    keep a little algae growing in the system so I can [scrape] the glass and feed some of my zooplankton
    To really grow zooplankton you need to dose phyto, and use rock-rubble.

    just wanted to have a little control of inorganic's
    The best solution is to just feed MORE. That way you get more inorganics AND more organics, so everybody gets fed. But another easy fix is to set the timer for more "off" hours for the light.

    always relied on large population's of scavenger's,soft coral etc as filter's?
    Yes same idea. They are limited though, as to how much filtering they can do. The scrubber will filter many times more then they did.

    was hoping the ats I was planning on building will do a ok job nothing heavy duty just enough to keep nitrate/phosphate just under 10 ppm just as a compliment along with rufuge/nutrent scrubber
    If you don't use the Kenya's, the scrubber (with 4 bulbs, 2-layers screens, high flow) will keep nutrients at zero, even with dosing phyto. If you do the Kenya's, either they will die from lack of food (they need a good amount of inorganics too), or your nutrients will be higher and you will have nuisance algae on the glass and rocks (because you will have to feed MUCH MUCH MUCH more to keep them alive). Unless you are propagating/selling the Kenya's, it's better to not have them.

    with a 750G pump what demension's of the box should I use? what size bulkhead's? 2 or 1
    750 divided by 35 = 21 inches wide. If you could put 24" T5's, then make the screen 24" wide. If not, then 18" bulbs. Make it as tall as you can. Ideally, you want a bulb every 2". Every 3" is ok but not strong. Every 4" is weak. Use a 1" pipe.

    will the scrubber I plan equal that of a 5G pail with 4 -23 watt light's?
    It will be much more powerful than a bucket, because the screen is much bigger, and the lights are much nearer the screen from left to right.

    if so then it will do only because I want some growth of algae in the tank
    Then feed MORE MORE MORE. Ten times more. The corals will grow much much more too.

    any advantages to having the screen I'm using and glueing together a second one to the other side making the squares line up or should I alternate the square's so they are cut in half?
    Does not matter how it is glued.

  10. #10

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    Re: ATS

    If you don't use the Kenya's, the scrubber (with 4 bulbs, 2-layers screens, high flow) will keep nutrients at zero, even with dosing phyto. If you do the Kenya's, either they will die from lack of food (they need a good amount of inorganics too), or your nutrients will be higher and you will have nuisance algae on the glass and rocks (because you will have to feed MUCH MUCH MUCH more to keep them alive). Unless you are propagating/selling the Kenya's, it's better to not have them.

    was hoping to sell them or harvest the kenya tree's

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