+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 17

Thread: Advice please!!

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    20

    Advice please!!

    So I have had my Algae scrubber running for a few days now, and have a bit of algae growth already on the screen. As suggested I moved my lights to be more directly in front of the screens. But I am still having the problem of water flow.

    I have a mag drive 5 pumping the water to my scrubber from the first chamber in my fuge. The first chamber is fed from the overflow box on the back of my tank. The problem is that the flow from the tank doesn't come in as fast as my pump pumps it out. I have a ball valve to control flow (though its really hard to turn!!) but if I turn the flow down so the first chamber doesn't empty, then the water doesn't flow fast enough over the screen. Any advice??

    Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20130304_240144_527.jpg
Views:	332
Size:	97.4 KB
ID:	4040Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20130304_240152_644.jpg
Views:	347
Size:	96.2 KB
ID:	4041Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20130304_240206_854.jpg
Views:	336
Size:	96.0 KB
ID:	4042Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20130304_240223_228.jpg
Views:	356
Size:	91.3 KB
ID:	4043Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20130304_240235_072.jpg
Views:	342
Size:	84.4 KB
ID:	4044

  2. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    pennsylvania, usa
    Posts
    406
    Put the pump in the same chamber as your scrubber. It looks way over sized.. maybe there is space for both the mag5 and a bit smaller screen

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    74
    Yeah unfortunately that type of ball valve isn't very "user friendly". They're best for fully open or fully closed operation.

    I'm having difficulty understanding the flow in your sump. Does the baffle in the pic run to the bottom? Did you insert it as part of the scrubber installation? And, where is the return to the tank and what feeds it? If your system supply and return worked before installing the scrubber there shouldn't be a reason that I can see, why it doesn't work now unless that baffle was installed after. Then I can see how that Mag5 will drain that chamber of the sump and dialing the flow to the scrubber back to prevent it starves the return pump.

    One thing you can do easily since you have a HOB overflow is add another siphon from it to the sump to increase flow if that's the problem. Maybe instead of feeding the scrubber with the Mag5, feed it with the additional siphon. Just some ideas to think about.

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    20
    The water returns to the tank from the last chamber (all the way on the left) with another mag 5 on the outside of the fuge. The only thing that is new is the pvc tubing with the screen attached and the mag 5 pump in the first chamber. It's just like an upside down L. The tubing from the overflow box goes almost all the way to the bottom of the first chamber.

    I tried to find another kind of valve, like the dial kind I have on the other pump, but all I could find was the ball valve.

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    74
    Yeah the other kind of valve would be a gate valve and they do a much better job of controlling flow. HD and Lowes have them in stock and they're not that expensive.

    As I said, you can add another siphon tube to the overflow and increase the flow to the sump and feed the scrubber with it, eliminating the Mag5 pump feeding the scrubber. It's also possible the slot you have cut for the screen is a bit too restrictive and not allowing enough flow once the screen is inserted into it. So maybe widen the slow to increase flow.

    Why didn't you just connect the scrubber to the overflow siphon that you already have feeding the sump? The second pump seems to be an unnecessary addition. It adds heat to the system and it also uses more electricity. I feed the scrubber directly from the overflow of the tank and getting about 225g/hr which I think is fine.



    If you're having issues with algae in the tank, it might be a good idea to clean out the sump a bit as it looks like there might be a lot of detritus built up in there, but it's hard to tell from the pics

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    20
    Yeah, there's a lot of macro algae, rocks, and a DSB in my fuge that I just kinda threw the scrubber on top of. I did think about attaching my scrubber directly to the overflow but then the first chamber wouldn't get any water. Not that its important, I guess. Though if I connected the scrubber to the overflow, I could just have it drain into the first chamber. the first chamber is only 8 3/4" x 7 3/4". Would that be wide enough? Right now my scrubber is 11" by about 9". And the PVC for the overflow is 1", not 3/4". The over flow box I got from my LSF, and I don't know where he got the clear U tube that I siphon the water with. If I am using two to siphon, won't that drain the tank faster than my return pump can fill it??

    Oh, and should I use a 1" or go back to the 3/4" for where the mesh attaches?

    I think it's time I start from scratch again. :-/

    Bilk, what's that extra PVC pipe extending from your scrubber on the right??
    Thanks!

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    74
    Hey Smokey. Just sitting at the computer doing some work and saw your response come via email

    Seems like you could cut the mesh to fit the size of the first chamber and not effect things much, if you wanted to maintain that volume in the sump/system. Does the baffle separating the first and second chamber go all the way down? If not you'd still have that volume, but less flow thru it I guess as the water will want to run to the return pump.

    Not knowing what size your system is, it's hard to determine what size down pipe you need from the overflow. The calculator will tell you the flow and then you can use one of the online calculators to determine the size pipe/hose you need to obtain that flow via a gravity fed system.

    My system is only net 46G so I have scaled down the supply from the tank to the sump with smaller diameter pipe and hose. Turning over about 225g/hr from my bucket test I may even go a bit lower as I've been reading about slow thru the sump in order to process more by the skimmer, but that might effect my scrubber output once it kicks in. No bioload in the tank right now and still in cycle. A 6" wide screen and 210G/hr was what the calculator arrived at when estimating my stocking and feeding. The pipe you asked about is an overflow in case the slot gets clogged for some reason. Water will exit through that pipe. Actually, though the tank is just cycling, the screen is accumulating brown algae and the brown algae that developed on the rocks and substrate is now gone. I have everything running as it would when stocked, lights and all, except any dosing as there's no need for it right now.

    Not sure you have to start from scratch. I think what you have there is easily modified and you shouldn't have any trouble. I would take the time to clean the sump while you're taking care of things. My sump got to look a bit similar and I have promised myself that wouldn't happen again. I see some people have equipment and sumps that look pristine and look as good as their tanks so it must correlate LOL

    Hope my two cents helps

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    20
    I have a 75 g tank plus the fuge. I guess if I empty the fuge, it will only be a sump, huh? I appreciate the help, Bilk! The baffle runs all the way to the bottom with 4 quarter sized holes at the top.

    I think tomorrow I'll go buy some new PVC and cut the downflow pipe and attach the slit PVC with the mesh so it hangs down into the first chamber. And this time I'll get a gate valve to control the flow!

    Where do I find the calculator to figure out what size and flow rate I should have? And what size PVC to get?

    Thanks!!

  9. #9
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
    Posts
    10,565
    There is no calculator for waterfalls, but the guideline is:

    Scrubbers are sized according to feeding. Nutrients "in" (feeding) must equal nutrients "out" (scrubber growth), no matter how many gallons or liters you have. So...

    An example VERTICAL upflow or waterfall screen size is 3 X 4 inches = 12 square inches of screen (7.5 X 10 cm = 75 sq cm) with a total of 12 real watts (not equivalent) of fluorescent light for 18 hours a day. If all 12 watts are on one side, it is a 1-sided screen. If 6 watts are on each side, it is a 2-sided screen, but the total is still 12 watts for 18 hours a day. This screen size and wattage should be able to handle the following amounts of daily feeding:

    1 frozen cube per day (2-sided screen), or
    1/2 frozen cube per day (1-sided screen), or
    10 pinches of flake food per day (2-sided screen), or
    5 pinches of flake food per day (1-sided screen), or
    10 square inches (60 sq cm) of nori per day (2-sided screen), or
    5 square inches (30 sq cm) of nori per day (1-sided screen), or
    0.1 dry ounce (2.8 grams) of pellet food per day (2-sided screen), or
    0.05 dry ounce (1.4 grams) of pellet food per day (1-sided screen)

    High-wattage technique: Double the wattage, and cut the hours in half (to 9 per day). This will get brown screens to grow green much faster. Thus the example above would be 12 watts on each side, for a total of 24 watts, but for only 9 hours per day. If growth starts to turn YELLOW, then increase the flow, or add iron, or reduce the number of hours. And since the bulbs are operating for 9 hours instead of 18, they will last 6 months instead of 3 months.

    HORIZONTAL screens: Multiply the screen size by 4, and the wattage by 1 1/2. Flow is 24 hours, and is at least 35 gph per inch of width of screen [60 lph per cm], EVEN IF one sided or horizontal.

    LEDs: Use half the wattage as above. 660nm (red) is best. You can mix in a little 450nm (blue) if you want.

    Very rough screen made of roughed-up-like-a-cactus plastic canvas.

    Clean algae off of the screen:

    Every 7 to 21 days, or
    When it's black, or
    When it fills up, or
    When algae lets go, or
    When nutrients start to rise

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    20
    Thanks Santa for the info. Math has never really been my strong suit. I have the mesh hanging with the 11" going the long (left to right) way. I make my own food and freeze it, and the cubes are about 1" x 1 1/2" two 23w CFLs, one on each side. If I cut the screen down to 8" x 8" will that be large enough? I was thinking of just using one of the CFLs and putting a reflector on the other side. I am running my lights for 18 hours right now.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts